'Stop misquoting Pope on condoms' – Mgr Anton Gouder

Trevor Lorenzo Mizzi

Apr 19th 2009, 19:57

That is a very good valid point Mr. Charles Grixti.

Charles Grixti

Apr 18th 2009, 16:52

So according to Mgr. Gouder's own words, 3/4 of a million African women and girls a year get raped. Yet, Mgr. Gouder's own organisation is advocating for these same Africans and their culture to come and settle in Malta and the rest of Europe. Go figure.

So much for multicutularism and moral relativism.

Oscar Cassar

Apr 15th 2009, 11:27

@ Stefan Attard

Jkun tajjeb ghal kulhadd jekk inficcu l-gheruq veri taghna, inkluz ghall-Knisja. Illum l-Knisja (partikolarment f’Malta) hija aktar bhala istituzzjoni mdawra bi tradizzjonijiet u tiprotegi certi ‘status’ li ghada tgawdi fis-socjeta’ aktar minn wahda miftuha ghal kulhadd u thares l-quddiem. Irridu naccettaw li kulhadd midneb u bhekk Kristu gie fostna, biex ifejjaq u jbaghti ghalina, mhux biex jaghjarna bid-dnubiet taghna hu personalment. Il-Knisja trid tfittex d-djalogu ma kulhadd u tkun simbolu ta’ paci u mhabba aktar minn istituzzjoni li timponi. Kristu ma iddejjaqx jider ma prostituti ecc u kontinwament prova jeduka lil kull settur. L-Knisja minflok trid tobliga kull settur u ghal dawn ir-ragunijiet l-Knisja qed titlef l-identita taghha.

simon sciberras

Apr 14th 2009, 20:17

Prosit Mons. Jalla kulħadd ikun ċar fi kliemu kif int int.

Martin Spiteri

Apr 14th 2009, 13:25

Is it really possible that the vatican is living the louis XVI era of absolutism? Is it possible that they really believe that this is going to last for long? Is it really possible to realise that the situation has become so bad for the catholic church, that churches and convents are closing by the hundreds every year? is it possible that they want to see the church sink in this manner? Where is MArtin luther? Where are the theologians who spoke and warned the church. Where is the vote taken by most bishops in time of Pope John Paul in favour of condoms to be used as prevention and not as contraception? does Fr Gouder know that the vote was 73% in favour of condoms? Does Fr Gouder know that the law should guide and not crush? Does Fr Gouder know that Christ detested the law when it was fundamentalistic and had no value?

Annalise Farrugia Bennett

Apr 13th 2009, 23:12

When is the church going to wake up and realise that these so called laws are out dated. I remember at secondary school PSD and religion teachers always stressed that safe sex isn't condoms but staying celebate until the right time, right time says who?? If we promote controceptives a bit more we might be able to avoid teenage pregnancies. Although not a lot of teens would use condoms but at least try and educate them; because STDs and teenage pregnancies are on the increase. The idea of the church is stay celebate until you find the right one for life (marrage). This is as bad as the chuch commenting about how many children one should have.

Stephen Borg Cardona

Apr 13th 2009, 20:48

This video is very bad PR for the Catholic church . Showcasing the views of right wing fundamentalists will contribute to further reductions in church attendance figures.

J Farrugia

Apr 13th 2009, 18:49

Trevor Lorenzo Mizzi

Apr 13th 2009, 18:39

@Edwin Formosa This Professor Green study that you are quoting must be the only study which came to the same conclusion as the Catholic Church. Unfortunately, the modern trends in academia is to succumb to special interest parties who have the means to make substantial donations to universities and therefore control the results that they wish from research and present their propaganda as fact. For instance, there are ‘studies’ that prove that global warming is a myth – however, when one digs down to find out who commissioned these studies, it turn out to be the Oil Lobby. There is also no conclusive proof that smoking cigarettes causes cancer in studies that turned out to have been commissioned by the Tobacco Lobby. In terms of saving human lives, condoms have been proved to work and that is the bottom line.

J Farrugia

Apr 13th 2009, 18:19

Just like this Kenneth ZT. When a person does not know the pater ave from the dogmas and starts interfering in religious matters then we are doomed. The stupidities he utters on moral and social subjects make an idiot look like a professor. At least Mons Gouder has put his interviewer in his rightful place. Keep it up Mons Gouder and start telling other priest do the same. The Church has been under attack since its foundation by her master Jesus Christ.

Charles Grixti

Apr 13th 2009, 18:09

@ Edwin Formosa First of all, you do not mention who is funding Professor Green's studies. It is a well know fact that even the most prestigious universities have been co-opted by Corporate and special interest 'think-tanks' who continually generate studies and statistics that reflect the opinions and beliefs of the entities who fund them, therefore giving legitimacy to falsehoods under the guise of academia. The real truth is that the majority of studies all agree that the use of condoms reduces significantly the spread of AIDS. A while back the Church was telling people in countries stricken by Aids not to use condoms because they have tiny holes in them through which HIV can pass - potentially exposing thousands of people to risk. Scientific research by a group including the US National Institutes of Health and the WHO prove that "consistent and correct" condom use reduces the risk of HIV infection by 90%. The WHO condemned the Vatican's views, saying: "These incorrect statements about condoms and HIV are dangerous when we are facing a global pandemic which has already killed more than 20 million people, and currently affects at least 42 million."

Kenneth Zammit Tabona

Apr 13th 2009, 16:50

Dear Oh dear there seems to be no limit to what people will do to get themeselves talked about!
The Church should have spoken about Racism long ago. There is no solution to the immigration phenomenon. Mgr Gouder says that the problem should be tackled in Africa itself. I agree; the only thing is that by the time some headway is made Africa will be empty!

As for the way Benedict XVI is interpreted I have said many times before that the Vicar of Christ should emulate Jesus and speak SIMPLY and CLEARLY and not in terms couched in obscure theological mumbojumbo. By doing so he is keeping apologists like Mgr Gouder fully employed clearing up his gaffes whether deliberate or no and whether they concern condoms or rainforests!

Clearly this Supreme Pontiff is becoming a boring embarrassment

S. Calleja

Apr 13th 2009, 16:09

The truth behind the Vatican's ban on contraception, showing very interesting results about the percentage of Catholics who are actually following the Church's teachings on the matter: http://www.catholicsforchoice.org/topics/reform/documents/TruthConsequencesFINAL.pdf

G Cutajar

Apr 13th 2009, 16:02

Well said Fr Gouder! I still cannot understand what
the fuss is all about everytime the Church speaks against the use of condoms. Putting the blame on the Church for the spread of HIV is ludicrous. As if a person who doesn't give a damn about the Church's teachings on extra-marital or pre-marital sex is going to have any qualms in refraining from the use of condoms because of the Church! U halluna!

Martin Spiteri

Apr 13th 2009, 15:25

@James Degiorgio At last someone who talks sense, but do not underestimate Mgr Gouder. It will put a feather in his cap. In anycase Nature always dictated and nature is speaking. Education was always the best way to control Aids. quoting the law and using it as a shield will not do anything, thank God the Church is made of old men. They will soon be replaced by young priests if they find or manage to ordain and have the guts to speak out against this inhumanity.

James De Giorgio

Apr 13th 2009, 13:16

The Pope and the Church will always be misquoted on condoms.
Try as you might to make people see sense by quoting the Ugandan success (Uganda´s AIDS rate is the lowest in sub saharan africa) through methods of education and absistence, the Church will always fail to convince the general public.

For the general public loves sex too much to ever admit it.

Moses Mula

Apr 13th 2009, 12:15

@Loiuse Vella, the root of racism is ignorance about other cultures that leads to non acceptance of people who come from a different group which does not resemble yours. In fact us humans are the root to racism as we `shelter ´ourselves in groups that we define as better than the other groups. Your remark that racism was not a problem in Malta before immigrants started arriving in Malta shows how naive you must be. I ask you this give me an honest answer, can you really say that pre-immigrant Malta, homosexuality was not seen as an abnormality by loads of Maltese, and that there was no anti-arab sentiments? Wake up and realise that racism is a global disease and Malta is no exeption.

George M Sant

Apr 13th 2009, 09:08

It would be instructive to learn the source of the research that allegedly supports the Pope's contentions about condoms and HIV. It seems so contrary to research published in scientific journals. The WHO bluntly considered "These incorrect statements...are dangerous when we are facing a global pandemic, which has already killed more than 20 million people". A leading editorial in The Lancet, one of the world's leading medical journals, questioned whether the Pope's "error" was "due to ignorance or a deliberate attempt to manipulate science to support Catholic ideology", and called for a retraction. The director of the WHO's HIV department asserted "there is no scientific evidence showing that condom use spurs people to take more sexual risks....condoms are highly (effective) to prevent the transmission of HIV". Quentin Sattentau, Professor of Immunology at Oxford summarised the "large body of published evidence demonstrating that condom use reduces the risk of acquiring HIV infection, but does not lead to increased sexual activity". If there is evidence to the contrary, that is scientific, factual, objective and verifiable, as opposed to indoctrinated opinion, then it should be published so that a balanced picture can be obtained and any erroneous course corrected.

Kenneth Cassar

Apr 13th 2009, 08:43

Most people here are missing the fact that the Catholic Church also opposes the use of condoms by married couples as a means of birth-control.

What Mgr Gouder is conveniently not saying is the following:

Hey, married couples. If you are unlucky enough to be in the low-income category and cannot afford to have children (or more than a few children), then ABSTAIN FROM SEX or rely on the unreliable "natural" method which Cana teaches but most ignore. If you do not abstain from sex, then hey...you can always dump your children on others by sending them to orphanages. After all, condoms are always evil, and having sex just for pleasure is a sin, even in marriage.

How about commenting on this, Mgr Gouder.

C.Caruana

Apr 13th 2009, 07:56

@Charles
@c.caruana

Please note that I'm another C.Caruana speaking here and not the same person. Then there seems to be 2 c.caruana. From now on I'll use another name then!!

Note: I hope that the editor of this news can verify and confirm this!!

A.Vella

Apr 13th 2009, 07:10

@A.Muscat : " So, rest assured divorce will eventually be introduced in Malta as a social necessity …. Its just a matter of time. Be patient please. "

SOCIAL Necessity?????? Next thing I know is that we'll have people divorcing as soon as they face the smallest of problems in their marriage (the typical passive attitude) .... instead of making the smallest of efforts (or big effort if need be) to reconcile and talk things over.
Family values? None.
Even though i believe that children can be brought up in a very good way by a single parent, I firmly believe that a solid family background is still the best way in setting up an example to the next generation.

Start thinking a bit maturely instead of thinking more what suits oneself.

John Falzon

Apr 13th 2009, 04:25

Here we go again, when will the Catholic Church, start to act responsibly?
FACT: The use of condoms reduces sexually transmitted diseases.
FACT: The Catholic Church does not have any respect for freedom of choice, whether it is related to abortion, homosexuality, celibacy, divorce, women in the priesthood etc.
FACT: The Catholic Church wants to hold on to its power and control by restricting the freedom of dividuals, as its history shows.
FACT: The Catholic Church is run by conservative old men, excludes 50% its members, by excluding all women from participating in the actual running and administration of its affairs.

Kris Scicluna

Apr 13th 2009, 04:09

what mgr Anton Gouder said regarding sex before marriage is very true. i know a large number of youths who are not married and do not have sex. however, they actually feel ashamed of themselves instead of being proud that they are the ones actually holding strong.

I think Mgr Anton Gouder has very clear ideas, we need more like him. keep it up!

Stefan Attard

Apr 13th 2009, 02:20

Nixtieq nghid prosit lil Mons Gouder. Nahseb li kif kulhadd ghandu dritt isemma lehnu anke l-knisja ghandha d-dritt u rwol li taghmel dan. Nahseb wkoll li ahna ilkoll ghandna nerghu nfittxu l-gheruq taghna qabel jkun tard wisq. ma nafx kif nistghu niggustifikaw il-hazin billi nghidu li hu tajjeb. forsi irridu ngghalu lil knisja (il-gisem) iddawwar l-ideat u l-principji taghha mibnija fuq dak li qal r-ras. nahseb li jidher bic-car li qed nghix f'epoka ta mewt u vojt kbir.

Charles Stafrace

Apr 13th 2009, 01:13

If the Church is hoping to gain by this ultra-conservative and fundamentalist stance, it is very, very wrong. Move with the times, please. At least if not with 2009, can the Church arrive where the rest of the civilised world was in the 1960s and 1970s? Malta and the Philippines are the only two countries in the whole world not to have the fundamental right to divorce. What are we, a clerical state, the same as Iran? Of course Mons. Gouder is against a referendum - he knows he would be voting on the losing side! As regards the Pope's visit to Africa, which is torn with AIDS, the bottom line is that he condemned the use of condoms. Period.

Joseph Ellul

Apr 13th 2009, 00:04

I see no problem with what the church advocates regarding sexual intercourse and the use of condoms etc.. The problem with humans is that we are sexual predetors by nature as we live in a sex orientated world. Anything and everything is based on some kind of mating. The difference between humans and other living beings or organisms is that we can make a choice . We have developed a sense of reason that makes us aware of other peoples' desire.
If we all respect the other person's desire than there will not be rape. All sexual intercourse will be consensual and the argument of condoms would not be part of any argument. The Chatholic Church is a religious organization with its rules and regulations based on the 10 comandments. God told us that if we live by the guide of these rules we have a better chance of having a long and fruitful life. Condoms are not the answer, they are an excuse.

Peter Bonnici

Apr 13th 2009, 00:03

@ Ian Galea
Read your first 2 sentences again and see whether you are as confused as I am. As for the rest of your piece, what on earth are you trying to say man?

s camilleri

Apr 12th 2009, 23:07

Priests should stop calling people racists just because they have a different opinion than their official one. And for the record Maltese people have nothing against people's race but their behavior and the fact that we are a small community which does not have the space for these people ( there are more Maltese people living abroad than in Malta) and nor have we got the resources.

Carima A. Magdi

Apr 12th 2009, 22:56

You are right Mr George Portelli. And because it is 2009 that we should act like humans. The human race is always developing in technology but we are forgeting our morals as human beings. Years pass and we are blinded by money and material things. No matter how many years pass the religion has been there since the beginning. Religions don't change according to what humans want. If you don't want to follow the church's teaching read your Holy book. For sure you won't find that God(in any Holy book) gives permission for His words to be changed.
The law of God has been and will always be the same. Time can never change it.

John A. Zammit

Apr 12th 2009, 22:50

Why does Mons. Gouder has to show concern about the position taken by Joseph Muscat about divorce? Is it just because he happens to be the leader of the Labour Party.? Is there any difference between divorce and the recognition of rights of cohabiting couples at par with those of married couples fostered by the other party? To me the difference is just a half an hour ceremony and the signing of a document. Why has Mons. Gouder NEVER showed any concern about the latter proposal? Just for the record I am against both proposals. To me those who cohabit ought never to be given the rights of husband and wife under any guise.

Ian Galea

Apr 12th 2009, 22:39

I very much believe that the church or any priest has the right to judge any other human being. A priest is a human being like all other and he has not right to judge what others do. 'the priests should never interfere in any political issue or decisions. Hearing something like this, make me feel that we are still living 40 or 50 year ago. Though I very much believe in God and I mean this from the heart, I really wish that the church in Malta stops putting interfering in social life. I hope that one day our church will have no influence in how the country is run or managed. These things are pushing people away from the church, but not from God. The use of condoms.... how can think of say that it is not right to use them... divorce who is the priest to come and judge me, or my relationship. Why do many catholic people and couples that are separated have to be prohibited from legalising their relationships, or even have their relationships blessed by God. It is amazing what they say and what they try to show these people.

George Portelli

Apr 12th 2009, 21:55

Here there are a lot who talk and a few who think. Yes I agree 100% that sex before marriage is wrong. you have to work with young teenagers to know what they think of sex. More so I do not know how many have children and speak to them about the risks involved. The only way by which STD's can be avoided is to abstain and have one steady relationship. The problem is that many want to use condoms to have one night stands as much as they want. It is not true that the use of condoms is limited to birth control but to abuse. Teach our young ones the truth please. Tell them that condoms are not 100% safe neither for STD's nor for unwanted pregnancies. They lower the risk but they do not abolish it. As to all those who are writing that this is 2009 and not some medieval year I want to stress out that yes this is 2009 and the church's teachings are there to be observed. Those who do not like it know what they have to do - I think that they have grown up enough.

Sandro Agius

Apr 12th 2009, 21:49

I agree totally with Mons.Gouder on these misquotes. I ask who says that the Pope did a foul by saying what he says; Do you say that condoms are the solution for aids? Those who give free condoms are thinking to educate people?

I don't know where morality is going nowadays. In few years some "experts" will come and say, yes we must educate also children to use such things. Is not better to teach the human being that the body is not a toy and that it must not control us, that values are more important than others things of those who insists that the church must shut up. Now that the church speaks are we going to close her mouth...is that freedom?

malcolm seychell

Apr 12th 2009, 21:36

Many catholics do not care any more what the church says and thank god they are doing this.

If we had to do what the church is asking we will go back 200 years to say the least.

To attack Lowell or anyone else will solve nothing. On illegal immigration we have a crisis.

To close the detention is no option as Mon Grech wants.

The church is going to lose more and more people.

Stephen Farrugia

Apr 12th 2009, 21:34

Many people have made very good valid points about immigration, in this message box and we should have some answers or the church should have to answer for its deeds.
The church is not above the state or the law !

Robert Callus

Apr 12th 2009, 21:16

Seems this pope gets misquoted too frequently, I wonder if it's out comprehension or his own comprehensibility the problem.

Mgr Gouder is insisting on hard evidence, statistics on the obvious - that most youths have pre-marital sex. On the other hand he backs an absurdity such as 'that sexual education on the use of condoms leads to more abuse' with just 'substantial research'.

Bradford McIntyre

Apr 12th 2009, 21:01

Church: CONDOMS DO STOP AIDS!

This is an example of how the Catholic Church's anti condom campaign is contributing to the spread of HIV.

The Pope refuses to recognize the harm the Catholic Church is causing with it's refusal to promote condom use in the prevention of HIV and AIDS.

The use of condoms saves lives and condoms work to prevent the further spread of HIV!

We know that individuals who are told they must refrain from sex or make pledges of abstinence that they are very often ill prepared and a condom is not used when they do engage in sex. They become infected!

Many women and men who considered themselves to be in a monogamous relationship were infected by their spouse. This is clearly evident now with the increase of HIV infections among married women.

Around the world the use of condoms is seen as a trusted weapon in the prevention of HIV infection, however, these efforts are often hampered by religious beliefs.

We will not see change in the HIV/AIDS pandemic until the use of Condoms are a standard practice for all!

Bradford McIntyre, HIV+ since 1984
Vancouver, Canada
www.PositivelyPositive.ca

edwin formosa

Apr 12th 2009, 20:28

Charles Grixti asks:
"Sex education and use of condom leads to more abuse" ??? How is that?

Edward C. Green, director of the AIDS Prevention Research Project at the Harvard Center for Population and Development Studies, answers

"Research into the spread of AIDS actually supports the position of the Catholic Church and the Pope.There is a consistent association shown by our best studies, including the US-funded 'Demographic HealthSurveys,' between greater availability and use of condoms and higher (not lower) HIV-infection rates," he explained. "This may be due in part to a phenomenon known as risk compensation, meaning that when one uses a risk-reduction 'technology' such as condoms, one often loses the benefit (reduction in risk) by 'compensating' or taking greater chances than one would take without the risk-reduction technology."

josephine cachia

Apr 12th 2009, 20:22

I totally agree with Albert Fenech comments.Well done Mgr.Gouder.If all priest were like you i will start belief in church again.

Jonathan Falzon

Apr 12th 2009, 20:07

Prosit Mgr Gouder. Semmejt hafna punti tajbin specjalment fuq il-free voteing fil-parlament. Nahseb in-nies in generali ghandom dejjem jahsbu fuq x'inhu l-aqwa gid ghal kulhadd mux biss fuq x'jaqbel lilom. B'ekk umbad jifmu ghaliex il-Knisja titkellem ekk fuq razzizmu, divorzju u affarijiet bhal dawn.

c caruana

Apr 12th 2009, 20:02

@Charles Grixti
who talked about rules?? If they deserve to come here, well yes I will welcome them. Everyone have the right to risk his life to save it. If I was an illegal immigrant I would do the same thing as they did. If you think we have too much illegal immigrants bla bla bla go and protest against the EU not against individuals that escaped death!!

Charles Grixti

Apr 12th 2009, 19:47

@C. Caruana

Here it is verbatim from what you wrote further down on this blog:

"1) If racism increased by the arrivals of illegal immigrants does not mean that the illegal immigrants are the cause of racism, it's the lack of maltese tolerance!! "

Lack of "Maltese tolerance" is equal to and means the same as "Maltese intolerance" in the
English language.

Eric Soames

Apr 12th 2009, 19:11

The church ruling on condoms is just that, a church precept. There is nothing in the Bible that speaks against using condoms. Plenty against adultery and fornication and the Church certainly has the right to expound on this, and for its followers to choose to obey or not. Condoms are just another way of not getting pregnant just like abstaining from sex when a woman is in her fertile period. Writing moved away from papyrus to computer (also not mentioned in the Bible), why shouldn't birth control progress too.

Muscat.Pat

Apr 12th 2009, 19:03

When Berlusconi talks about illegal immigration the Vatican does not rock the boat.. When Maroni says that illegal immigrants have to be repatriatedd, the Vatican stays silent. Ah but when the Maltese speak about illegal immigration some of the local Church representatives speak up. We that observe what happens in Italy and what happens in Malta, why are we being treated like a bunch of idiots?

Chris Mifsud

Apr 12th 2009, 19:01

"and speaks of the threat of pre-marital sex." - Mgr A Gouder .

To whom is pre-marital sex a threat ?

Comments like this are only helping to alienate the church even more than it already is .

The church needs to move with the times ... This is 2009 and not 1949 .

Charles Grixti

Apr 12th 2009, 18:58

"Sex education and use of condom leads to more abuse" ??? How is that?

Sex education and use of condoms reduces sexually transmitted disease and unwanted chiildren. Where is the abuse in this? Unless of course Mgr Gouder is referring to the abuse resulting from not listening and believing in what the Catholic church teaches, even if it is diametrically opposed to common sense, and scientific fact. How about the abuse of Church power to the detriment of humanity, Monsignor?

As for the matter of the illegal immigrants that the Church in Malta seems to be so keen on, just as long as the tax-payers are footing the bills and that Church property remains intact, I will only believe in the Church's sincerity when they open up all their Churches and institutions, and properties, and sell their priceless art treasures, to house and feed these
people. Otherwise, all they say smacks of hypocrisy!

katie micallef

Apr 12th 2009, 18:42

@edward bonnici - 'Is a society with 25-30 % of born babies is either of unknown fathers or out of wed-lock teenager pregnant mothers a healthy society?'
- this percentage might be less if our youth were properly educated about condoms and safe sex don't you think?

@ Mgr Anton Gouder - i cannot believe there is any credible research (you have not even mentioned what research you base you 'facts' on) that says that educating people about condoms causes more abuse.
And why are you concerned about a free vote on divorce? Afraid the people might not choose what you want them to?

A. Muscat

Apr 12th 2009, 18:33

Ray Buttigieg
It took the Catholic Church about 1600 years to admit that planet Earth is not flat (as stated in the Bible). So, rest assured divorce will eventually be introduced in Malta as a social necessity …. Its just a matter of time. Be patient please.

SIMON AMATO

Apr 12th 2009, 18:31

I WISH TO COMMENT ABOUT THIS. FIRST I CAN ASSURE MGR GOUDER THAT I STILL HAVE GOOD VALUES THANK GOD BUT I CAN NEVER AGREE ABOUT WHAT HE IS SAYING. THIS POPE IS TOTALLY DIFFERENT THAN THE LATE POPE SURE!! HE IS VERY CONTROVERSIAL THAT'S THE TRUTH.IT WILL BE BETTER IF MGR GOUDER STOPS MAKE PREFERENCES REGARDING LOCAL FESTI. WHY CANCEL PAOLA FEAST ONLY???REGARDING DIVORCE I TOTALLY AGREE WITH IT. AND PLS MGR GOUDER WE ARE NOT IN THE 60S NOW!!

C.Caruana

Apr 12th 2009, 18:31

@ Charles Grixti

Now where did I say that the Maltese are intolerant? I only commented on this issue and won't be going into the illegal immigration saga because I don't understand it!
I believe that laws given by God are there to be obeyed by EVERYONE for our benefit after all!

Charles Sammut

Apr 12th 2009, 18:21

I have no objection at all for all true catholics in Malta to abstain from sex outside marriage or even completely. What I object to, is that people like Mgr Gouder here, insisting on imposing their medieval values on those like me who have long since abandoned the catholic church.

Regarding what is referred to as racism, with or without Norman Lowell, this was bound to manifest itself. Gunther Verheugen himself said that should a German town of 350,000 inhabitants be subjected to a similar invasion, there would be an instant revolution.

I do not call it racism, it is simply common sense.

F Borg

Apr 12th 2009, 18:06

Gosh! Is it 2009 in Malta, or 0029?

Charles Grixti

Apr 12th 2009, 18:04

@C. Caruana.

I hope that if you think that the Maltese are intolerant of 'illegal immigrants', that you likewise have no problems in welcoming all strangers to share your home whenever they feel like it too, and maybe even make the rules for how you run your home and at the end have equal shares in it with your own children and their descendants. Anything less than that, and you should not be calling the Maltese intolerant.

Ray Buttigieg

Apr 12th 2009, 17:26

with all due respect to Mgr Anton Gouder, who is he to critisize a politician for wanting to introduce a basic right found in all EU countries. He should have spoken before Malta joined the EU. Now that we are in we demand same rights as our european brothers and sisters. Malta is a secular state and its a shame on us as a people that we still fear people like Mgr Gouder and his institution when it comes to demanding our civil rights. Yes divorce must be introduced in Malta.

C.Caruana

Apr 12th 2009, 17:22

I'm a youth myself and believe that the pope and Mgr Gouder are 100% right about this issue. The social ills today are due to lax values! God gave laws to men and women Not to oppress him/her but for their own good to lead a good life on Earth.
Is all this psychological persecution of the church a sign of the end times?? Jesus was right when HE said that the church will be always persecuted!
God save us now from ourselves!

To all practicing Catholics: Please speak up and defend the church of God! He will remember our deeds and save us from our sins.

edwin formosa

Apr 12th 2009, 17:11

Thank you Fr Gouder. Praise God for priests with mettle enough to put what's right and good for their flocks before what is politically expedient. We need to remember that wrong, however prettily wrapped, is not right The values which have traditionally shaped Malta’s national life and identity and sustained a healthy and harmonious society, are being challenged by the importation of certain cultural models (which, tragically, sap the very energies which young people bring to society) and try to marginalize those who hold to traditional moral teachings on sexuality. Some bloggers never lose a chance to show their anti catholic hatred believing and interpreting statements in their own way, without bothering to check the facts and circumstances.We are facing a miniority with disproportionate influence in media

edwin formosa

Apr 12th 2009, 17:09

Thank you Fr Gouder. Praise God for priests with mettle enough to put what's right and good for their flocks before what is politically expedient. We need to remember that wrong, however prettily wrapped, is not right The values which have traditionally shaped Malta’s national life and identity and sustained a healthy and harmonious society, are being challenged by the importation of certain cultural models (which, tragically, sap the very energies which young people bring to society) and try to marginalize those who hold to traditional moral teachings on sexuality. Some bloggers never lose a chance to show their anti catholic hatred believing and interpreting statements in their own way, without bothering to check the facts and circumstances.We are facing a miniority with disproportionate influence in media

Peter Gauci

Apr 12th 2009, 16:10

Condom machines are a must. It's a shame malta still suffers from certain cultural shocks such as buying condoms. In america buying a condom is like buying a chocolate. Until University's KSU does what is right for all students, i propose using alternative sources such as the local website to buy condoms discreetly.

N.Attard

Apr 12th 2009, 15:55

Unfortunately the church just keeps living in a bubble. They never want to accept the reality. Although obviously I would prefer abstinence for my children before having a steady partner, I would rather prefer them to have sex 3 times a week using a condom that only once a week using none!

Alex Spiteri

Apr 12th 2009, 14:27

"Publicly, it was kick-started by someone who we initially treated as a joke - some used to poke fun at him when he spoke about this problem in an aggressive manner. Then we realised he was fanning the flames. The media didn't realise how serious it was when it gave publicity to this person"

blaiming an individual over the 'rise of racism' clearly shows the anti-nature philosophy these people blindly believes in. racialism, or whether u want to call it racism, is a natural instinct like any other feeling every living thing poses. humans and also animals got basic instincts, like the instinct to love your own race and protect it. it basically helped them evolved throughout thousand of years.

why is that although many type of fishes swim in the same waters never mix? why is that different races of birds even if they live in the same area never interbreed? why is that different wild cats in the savannah never mix? i guess there isn't any individual saying fish, birds and other animals not to racially mix! they simply follow their basic instincts, which racialism is one of them!

Kevin Cassar

Apr 12th 2009, 14:22

This is Brilliant!!!!! Asking for PROOF and FACTS when this person is in an institution based on BELIEF!!!!! It's funny how these people can think they know everything about anything, ask for proof when someone opposes but then when confronted on their own issues say it's God's will or a matter of faith!!! How convenient!!! One final comment that should make people like Mgr Gouder think is this: Recently we have all heard about the tragedy that happened in italy with the earthquake that hit them. We all know for a FACT that the Vatican and the church have incredible material riches. So how ironic was it that the "material girl" Madonna gave $500,000 for the cause and the church - nothing? Oh wait, hang on, they offered some prayers.

rene joseph

Apr 12th 2009, 14:13

are we going back in time, with the church opposing the PL in an election? I hope the PN will not be silent this time round. Divorce has to get in, whether the church likes it or not.

Edward Bonnici

Apr 12th 2009, 14:09

In defense of Mgr Anton Gouder.

Is a society with 25-30 % of born babies is either of unknown fathers or out of wed-lock teenager pregnant mothers a healthy society?
Is a society with youth immersed in drugs and alcohol a healthy society?
Is a society with the university students main concern is the lack of parking space and the lack of condoms machines a promising society?
If we see the above as very dangerous issues, then we share the view of the church. If we see nothing wrong with the above we are blind then

These alarming states of affairs putting our governments’ financial resources at stake. Do you know how much our government fork out on welfare cheques? The answer is shivering indeed! No social welfare system could continue to contain such expenses.
Shall we keep opposing the Church teaching until the whole social system collapse?

Joe Cassar

Apr 12th 2009, 14:01

I don't see anybody misquoting the Pope on condoms.

What I see are many - like Mgr Gouder - who are mounting a damage-limitation exercise after the Pope went against proven, scientific evidence and said that the use of condoms actually increases the risk of aids.

Eric Soames

Apr 12th 2009, 14:01

Cheap shot at Mr Lowell. Despite some of his views that might be considered a tad extreme, the core of his message was and is valid and started a grass roots movement now echoed by politicians. His was a voice crying out in the wilderness, if the Monsignor would indulge me a biblical phrase, but no longer.

ALBERT FENECH

Apr 12th 2009, 13:42

By the same yardstick, we know very well that today almost everybody is on the make, or on the fiddle, or trying to make a profit for themselves in some way or other. Hence, we should also change our rules and regulations about theft, tax evasion and dishonesty. After all, we are only human and only flesh and blood! And then, why stop there? There are probably as many people who love sex with under-aged persons as there are gay people, so now the Church and the Law should also accommodate paedofiles because they are also humans. There again, why stop at anything? Many persons covet their neighbour's wife, hate their parents and would not think twice about cheating their fellow human beings. So, why have rules that govern responsibility and morality? Let everybody do as they please and then everybody will be happy and the Church will be very popular.

Andrew Camilleri

Apr 12th 2009, 13:40

Not every young person has sex. I'm a young person and university student myself. And so are my friends. But that's beside the point.

Completely in agreement with Fr. Gouder.

Anton Portelli

Apr 12th 2009, 13:32

Like Ms L. Vella I ask Both Mgr. Gouder and also the Bishop of Gozo who recently attacked the Goverment for his detention policy, are they both ready to give the vast number of Church premises like Lourdes home, St. Joseph institute, The Curia Flats in Marsalforn, and various parish centres and halls around Malta and Gozo to house illegal immigrants. . Are the various varish priests ready to cancel the external celebrations and fireworks for the patron saints' festas and use the money collected to better the conditions of these people. If they are ready to do so then the Church in Malta can preach more about this subject.
Regarding the introduction of divorce please stop harassing and rubbing salt in the wounds of those who are suffering this social injustice in Euro Malta. Malta is the only country in the Western world accompanied only by the Philippines in the East who does not have a divorce Law. Again adding insult and pains to those who need a divorce there is the fact that if one has enough money to get it abroad it is recognised by our Law Courts.

ALBERT FENECH

Apr 12th 2009, 13:31

I am not a religious person myself but am always astounded how pronto people are to attack the Church and anything religious. I fear this is a result of their own insecurity and very often because of their crass ignorance. The Pope and the Roman Catholic Church cannot condone the use of condoms and it certainly is NOT the answer to the curbing of AIDS. The answer to AIDS is that persons become more responsible and recognise that mere sex is just a gratification of an animal instinct. OK, so there is nothing wrong with instant gratification - after all, we only live once. But there again, because I want to gratify myself I cannot expect the Roman Catholic Church to change its teachings and align them to my selfish need for gratification. Much the same argument holds valid for male and female homosexuality. If you want to be like that, that's up to you, but don't expect the Church to bend its rules to accommodate your gratification. Rules are rules and you either exist within them, or outside of them. Don't expect them to change because you are selfish and seek self-gratification.

c.caruana

Apr 12th 2009, 13:25

@louise vella
I hope you're not serious!!
1) If racism increased by the arrivals of illegal immigrants does not mean that the illegal immigrants are the cause of racism, it's the lack of maltese tolerance!!
2) If we agree that the conditions in detentions centers are better than those in their contries, does this mean that we don't have to imporove their condition?
3) You are contradicting yourself, first you are telling the church to welcome illegal immigrants in the church private property and than ur critizing the church that with it's help, illegal immigrants are encouraged to come here.
P.S: Normally I'm not a big fan of the catholic church.

Stephen Farrugia

Apr 12th 2009, 12:12

The church is playing politics with the immigration issue because it promotes an extreme Liberal view of the issue by calling it ' racism'.
There is also a constitutional court case and I thought one was not allowed to talk about ongoing court cases.
The national interest, regarding security, is bluntly of no interest to the church and this should be a serious concern, to all people with Maltese passports.
The church is showing that it is out of control regarding politics and thinks that they running the government or should i say, they are governing country.
People, be worried!

Ruth Grima

Apr 12th 2009, 12:09

Even the medical journal the Lancet has accused Pope Benedict XVI of distorting scientific evidence to promote Catholic doctrine following his remarks about condom use and HIV? This is a well known and highly respected medical journal, not just any old media. They also pointed out that the pope was putting millions of lives at risk - no statement to be taken lightly, of course. In my view, that's something that should make the church stop and take notice, but instead it just goes into denial and becomes defensive.

If the pope wants us Catholics to take him at all seriously, he has to seethe realities of today and catch up with the times. These latest arguments from the pope that condoms do not prevent Aids echo previous claims made by some senior clergy that the virus can pass through rubber.

It seems to me that the pope is living in other times.

Martin Spiteri

Apr 12th 2009, 12:08

Mgr Gouder,
I love the church but I dislike people who use the law like the jews did with Christ. The law guides us and does not bind us to fundamentalism. Church numbers are decreasing drastically. I believe in a future Church built more on the values of love than the law. All the church councils decreed and generated more laws. If you look and read your books carefully they all contradict themselves, thanks to your so called infallibility!!

M Pace

Apr 12th 2009, 12:02

For facts, figures and statistics you may wish to consult the unit dealing with (or trying to deal with, in the face of a non-existing sexual health policy) sexually transmitted diseases. The physician heading the unit will have plenty to brief you on.

Martin Spiteri

Apr 12th 2009, 11:46

Mgr Gouder likes to joke this wonderful Easter Sunday. If he likes to quote and live by the law he is contradicted severely by Christ and not by other humans. IT seems that some people shelter under the canopy of the law. The law speaks!!! The law is not perfect it has been made by man so it is full of flaws. When the church speaks of condoms , speaks merely from a point of view which is purely legal and has no practical solution. Everyone knows that condoms are not 100% safe while everyone knows that what the church is saying is not 100% correct either. Plus the church has never made peace with human sexuality. It is still suffering from good old St Paul and our dear St Augustine. So dear mgr Gouder very few are listening to your cold laws about human sexuality. The church is living cut off from the real world. A more humane approach would be more appreciated besides humans are made of flesh not of steel.

A Montebello

Apr 12th 2009, 11:38

I got increasingly frustrated listening to this interview.
If Mgr Gouder needs statistical proof that many young people are having sex (to varying degrees), then he is far, far removed from reality, and I hope - nay, i pray - that his blinkered opinions are personal, do not reflect that of the Roman Catholic Church. The facts are there and he must know this.
Regarding divorce, the example Mgr Anton gives about taking a wife or husband "until they start bothering me" is cute. How about taking a husband "until he starts beating me" - as another example.
The irony of all this is - and I say this without researching the facts - the church has divorce. I know of a number of nuns and priests who left the church to live lay lives.

louise vella

Apr 12th 2009, 11:14

Mgr Gouder says about illegal immigrants: “we need to work to stop them leaving their country”. Does he agree that we also need to work to stop them from coming to and reaching our country?

Mgr Gouder says the illegal immigrants “are living in inhuman conditions in our centres”. Does he agree that, unfortunately, these conditions are sometimes better than what the illegal immigrants have known in their countries of origin? How many empty or half empty premises does the church have, in Malta and Gozo, and is it prepared to open them as centres for illegal immigrants? Would the church be ready to ask the views of the parishioners concerned before doing so?

Does Mgr Gouder agree that racism was not a problem in Malta before the illegal immigrants started coming in boats, uninvited and unwelcome? So what is at the root of racism? Does he agree that the advocacy work being done by some of the church organizations he mentions acts as an encouragement to more arrivals of illegal immigrants?