Ahmadiyya Malta condemns attacks on churches in Nigeria

Ms.D. Galea

Dec 28th 2011, 11:14

Care to explain to the ignorant conspiracy theorists what you know about Abrogation of the Koranic law, the concept of Taqqijja, Waqft land, the theories of Dar Ul Harb and Dar Ul Salaam, and basic human rights awarded to women and non-muslims "as seen from the Islamic point of view" ie Sharia law.

I hope you realise that EVERY word in the Koran is Allah's own word that is NOT open for interpretation (by any tom ,dick or harry or any Johnnie-come-lately muslim apologist of a traslator) but remains UNCHARGED and valid TILL THE END OF TIME because every word in the Koran is considered PERFECT. In other words, everything written in the Koran has to be taken LITERALLY.

I also have news for you. It is not only the Koran that you must know word by word and take literally. The suras in the Hadiths are also to be taken in consideration by any devout muslim wishing to lead a typically muslim life.

Now, Mr Schembri , care to enlighten us about the Suras as well, as the Koran so that we ignorant infidels may learn?

c p agius

Dec 28th 2011, 07:03

Turkey and Bosnia herzegovia are both muslim and European yet the situation is far from how you are trying to depict it.......They elect a secular parliament and both are aspiring to join the EU....Probably you are going to say that their sole objective to join the EU is to spread Islam...typical rethoric which is the bread and butter of islamophobics

Other quasi secular "muslim: countries include Morocco, Tunisia, Lebanon and Egypt,,,

Graham Holme

Dec 28th 2011, 08:26

Turkey joins the E.U.?
The Islamification of Europe another step nearer.
Jihad paramount on the agenda of Islam.
The fictitious world leader being referred to,was depicting the way Muslims submit to Allah

Graham Holme

Dec 28th 2011, 08:40

I have a friend,born into the Muslim faith.Muslim in name only,he is not a practicing Muslim.
He met a Christian girl,marriage was on the agenda,for obvious reasons no way will she convert to "The Religion Of Peace"
He decided to denounce Islam,convert to Christianity.
On announcing his decision to become an apostate,was subject to death threats from his close family who are practicing Muslims.Through fear he dare not renounce Islam
"The Religion Of Peace"seems to rule through intimidation,fear,threats upon ones well being

Pauline Abela

Dec 28th 2011, 09:03

@ c p agius. You still did not answer Graham's question. Do I take it then that you agree that the description given is that of an evil dictator?

carlos ellul

Dec 28th 2011, 07:18

The difference between Christianity and Islam is that you won't find quotes which encourage violence and instructs punishment in the new testament. Jesus didn't engage himself in wars with the enemy, his 'revolution' was purely peaceful and he lived what he preached by dying on the cross

So please stop comparing Christianity with Islam as much as you should stop comparing the middle ages to today's world. We should have learnt a thing or two since then shouldn't we?

Emma Xerri

Dec 27th 2011, 21:50

Suhail, you must be reading your Koran all wrong. The earlier peaceful passages have been abrogated and replaaced by the latter violent and bloodthirsty passages. Please correct your mistake before you are put to death for apostasy.

"Taqiyya" anyone?

Emma Xerri

Dec 27th 2011, 22:01

A phobia is an irrational fear.

However fear of Islam is a real fear.

Yes, I fear for the discrimination against women and non-Muslims and gays. I fear for the freedom to wear what I like, I fear the violence inherent in Islam, I fear for the barbarous killing of animals for food, I fear for the 'marriage' of young girls as old as 8 years to men old enough to be their grandfathers, I fear for marital rape (which is condoned), I fear for the punishment of stoning for adultery, I fear for public beheadings and amputation, I fear the 'honour killings of girls and women by their own families. In short ,I fear for the loss of liberty and all that makes life beautiful.

As far as going to Church every Sunday, no I do not because I am an atheist.

c p agius

Dec 28th 2011, 07:07

Emma Xerri - the issue is not islam but certain ppl who misinterpret the religion....There are muslim countries within Europe where onecan find gays bars, atheists opening raoaming all over the placeetc etc etc.......

c p agius

Dec 28th 2011, 07:26

Emma It is irrational fear ...Although som muslims do engage in these activities they are not representative of over 1 billion muslims worldwide....I travelled to at least 10 muslim countries and beleive me I've NEVER met a man who is married more than 1 woman, i never came across public executions (stoning, hanging etc etc)....I met loads of gays even if i am note one myself......

Go and visit Morocco, Turkey, Bosnia, Albania, Lebanon, Egypt and Tunisia for example......You'll find thousands of girls wearing mini skirts walking hand in hand with their sisters covered from top to bottom..And yes they drive cars and probably more adventereous than Maltese Christian girls because the y drive motorcycles too.....Obviously there are countries where all the above is inexistent. Saudi ARabia ia a classic example. But ask yourself the question "Are Saudis happy with the sitauation?" of course not but they are controlled by a US backed dictatorship and it s almost impossibl for the people to revolt....

Having mentioned death penalties do you know that the US still executes people...They got lethal injections and electric chairs. They are both unchristian acts yet they are performed by the fastest growing christian country in the world

P Bonnici

Dec 27th 2011, 17:56

' no passage is clearly quoted; at best, a quotation is offered that is out of context.'

Muslims always say this whenever they cannot explain some unpleasant quotes from the Koran. The Koran is very vague and hard to understand. If God really wanted to give a message, he/she/it would have made it clear and unambiguous and he/she/it would have written it in other languages not just Arabic.

I suggest that people read 'Politically Incorrect Guide to Islam' by Robert Spenser before commenting here. One can read readers' reviews of the book below:

http://www.amazon.com/Politically-Incorrect-Guide-Islam-Crusades/dp/0895260131

"La ikraha fid-deen" literally means 'no hate in religion'. 'ikraha' means hate and it is similar to the Maltese: ikrah (ugly), stkerrah (dislike)

I wonder if "La ikraha fid-deen" is practised by Muslims in Malaysia, Indonesia and Bali where Christians, Buddhists and Hindus suffer all sorts of discrimination; I hate seen this with my own eyes and not read about.

Graham Holme

Dec 27th 2011, 18:10

Think all Muslims are taught this in the school curriculum,because they all employ the same tactics
How to debate with Infidels

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HIqMZkrdL-w.

Emma Xerri

Dec 27th 2011, 20:27

The same teaching in the Koran that 'there is no compulsion in religion' has been abrogated by later passages, such as, death to apostates.

This is just one example of the schizoid teachings found in the Koran, but unfortunately the violent passages in the Koran are the ones that are valid since the later uttering and teachings of Mohammed supersede and annul previous teachings on the same subject (most of the peaceful passages are from the Medina period when Mohammed was still largely unknown and still powerless, whereas the bloodier passages are from the later Mecca period when Mohammed was an established and powerful warlord.) Most non-Muslims (and some Muslims) do not know this. Those Muslims who come to deceive (Taqiyya – deceit when dealing with infidels) and defend the indefensible always use these milder but invalidated teachings.

Dealing with Apostates

Bukhari :: Book 9 :: Volume 84 :: Hadith 57

Narrated 'Ikrima:

Some Zanadiqa (atheists) were brought to 'Ali and he burnt them. The news of this event, reached Ibn 'Abbas who said, "If I had been in his place, I would not have burnt them, as Allah's Apostle forbade it, saying, 'Do not punish anybody with Allah's punishment (fire).' I would have killed them according to the statement of Allah's Apostle, 'Whoever changed his Islamic religion, then kill him.'"

Emma Xerri

Dec 27th 2011, 21:44

First, 'tu quoque' is not a rational reasoned arguement, but unfortunately apologisits for Islam such as yourself have only this as a defence (and a poor one indeed).

Secondly, and I feel that this is a point that you fail (or do not want) to understand is that while Christians, Jews, Buddihists, Hindus, etc. may do wrong, by doing this they are goind against their religions' teachings Whereas, the wrongs that Muslims do are enshrinedand encouraged in the Koran and the Haddith. Islam is alone amongst the modern world religions that advocates violence as a virtue and indeed a 'shahhid" or witness for the faith of Allah is guaranteed heaven and his 72 virgins (or 72 raisins as some translations have it). Punto e Basta!

carlos ellul

Dec 27th 2011, 15:01

What Hitler did was nothing remotely linked to Christianity though. There's NOTHING in the new testament that remotely suggest Hitler's ideology which was based on race superiority. In matter of fact Jesus main aim was to extend God's promise beyond the promised people borders. If Jesus was born in Nazi Germany he would have been killed because he was a JEW.

Can anyone say the same thing about the Islam though? Is there anything in the Koran that is intolerant to people with different believes and if the answer is no then why so many Islamic countries are intolerant to 'non believers'?

c p agius

Dec 27th 2011, 18:04

Christ didn't preach hate but this is what Christians did in Srebrenica......Same with Islam

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cwq6k4WiwHo&feature=related

carlos ellul

Dec 27th 2011, 18:37

Same argument. In Screbenica it was a race issue. You won't find one quote in the new testament which justify racism or lack of tolerance towards other religions. Can you say the same about Islam? And if the answer is yes then how come there's discrimination towards minorities in so many Muslim countries?

Im not a christian but I find it very hard to understand how one can compare the new testament with the Koran. The ideology behind it is so different. I mean you wont find Jesus dictating how one should punish prostitutes wouldn't you?

c p agius

Dec 27th 2011, 21:47

Carlos - so if Christians terrorists cause chaos you don't blame Christianity but if muslim terrorists cause havoc then you argue that ISLAM embraces their acts...?!?!?!!? What rationale is this?

By the way the Christian bible speaks of God destroying enemies and those who opposed him (vide Genesis, Deutronomy, Exodus etc etc).....Ma nahsibx li hemm ghalfejn naghtik ezempji....Fittes u ssib

carlos ellul

Dec 28th 2011, 07:08

I have never talked about terrorism but mere lack of tolerance to minority religions. Anyway I will gladly answer that issue to you too. How can you ever link terrorism with Jesus Christ? The man kept on preaching about peace, tolerance and oppressor's rights (give Ceaser what is of Caeser) despite living in a land which was conquered, discriminated and oppressed by foreign rule himself? Its like saying that Gandhi is guilty for any violence made by Hindu in India. Its ridiculous isn't it?

Now can you say the same about Mohammed? Would you find quotes like "this Slay the idolators wherever ye find them, and take them captive, and besiege them, and prepare for them each ambush. Fight against such of those who have been given the Scripture as believe not in Allah nor the last Day…. Go forth, light-armed and heavy-armed, and strive with your wealth and your lives in the way of Allah!" in the new testament? That is why I find it really hard to compare Jesus ideology with Mohammeds. Oranges and Apples comes in mind.

Graham Holme

Dec 27th 2011, 08:47

Please drop this facade,Islam is the religion of Peace,when the many barbaric acts committed world wide on a daily basis prove beyond a shadow of doubt otherwise
You fail to mention the other quotes from the Koran,smite the neck of unbelievers,take neither Jew or Infidel as your friend,on and on and on,but sure you will bring the "How to debate an Infidel"into play,,,, the translation from Arabic to English is no correct
There are plenty of apostates out there,who had the courage to denounce this so called religion masquerading under the name of Islam,who openly state Islam is far from a peaceful religion
Suggest you listen to the words of Wafa Sultan,who exposes Islam in all its glory,from sanctioned sexual gratification with new born babies,to its plan for world domination

c p agius

Dec 27th 2011, 18:01

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cwq6k4WiwHo&feature=related

Watch this Graham......8342 muslims butchered by Chrisitans back in 1995...

Peter Agius

Dec 26th 2011, 22:32

Well said Mr.Bonnici. And by the way there are about 1000 Mark Borg in the register. He gives his full name but hides by the multitude of it.

carlos ellul

Dec 26th 2011, 22:09

You're mentioning the 1400s while we're living in 2011. If Islam is truly a tolerant religion then why there is discrimination against Christians in so many Islamic nations?

Graham Holme

Dec 26th 2011, 19:29

Wonder when the crusades,etc would be brought into the equation
We used to burn witches at the stake,etc,but now live in the 20th century,and unlike Islam,which still lives in the dark ages have become civilized
Number off terrorist attacks committed by Muslims,Islam,world wide since 9/11,at present stands at 18,190and counting

c p agius

Dec 26th 2011, 20:05

g) the Holcaust orchestrated by a Christian nation and a Christian dictator
h) the USTASE backed by the Croat Catholic church
i) the Croat Catholics's attack on the muslim Bosniaks in Mostar
j) the Christan Serbs's attack on muslims in Srebrenica...
k) the catholic church's efforts to help Nazis escape justice




My point is simple: DO NOT POINT AT MUSLIMS........CHRISTIANS HAVE THEIR FAIR SHARE OF HATE TOO .HATE KNOWS NO BORDERS

c p agius

Dec 26th 2011, 20:07

having mentioned numbers bear in mind that the number of Jews killed by Christians only 60 years ago amounted to 6,000,000.......Yes Hitler, Geobbles, Himler, Hess were all Christian

Graham Holme

Dec 26th 2011, 20:57

c p agius
Re the Holocaust
Suggest you do some research.
How many battalions of Muslim SS were in the death camps,slaughtering the Jewish population.?
The same old arguments come to the fore
We are talking about MUSLIM,ISLAMIC terrorist attacks,now today,yesterday,tomorrow.
Why do all those who defend "The religion of peace"bring into the equation atrocities committed by other religions that took place years,centuries ago?

c p agius

Dec 26th 2011, 21:36

@ Graham.....i mentioned terrorist acts perpetrated by Christians not because i hate Christians but simply to show you that hate knows no borders...........There are good Muslims and bad muslims in the same way there are good Christians and bad Christians......

By the way Srebrenica is only 15 years old (Srebrenica = 8,342 muslims butchered by orthodox christians)

c p agius

Dec 26th 2011, 21:57

RE the holocaust...you are right: there were a number of muslim battalians but it is fact that the abosulte majority of the perpetrators were dedicated Christians backed by the Roman catholic church....All those condemed to death during the Nuremberg trials were all Christians if not mistaken......

By the way the holocause is only 60 years old........Oh and i forgot to mention Franco's partnership with the catholic church durinf the second world war.....Likewise, that's less than 60 years old

carlos ellul

Dec 26th 2011, 22:07

If Hitler was christian then I am Santa Claus. Please check how many priests ended up in concentration camps or risk their lives. Hitler placed race above anything, even God himself. There's nothing in the new testament that can justify what Hitler did. and that's why the majority of the Christian world went against him. Can anyone say the same about Islam (and any possible hatred or discrimination towards non christian?). Can anyone answer me why Christians are discriminated in the majority of all Islamic nations?

c p agius

Dec 27th 2011, 07:55

@ CArlos....

The fact that Hitler sent priests in concentraiton camps doesn't imply that he wasn;t a christian himself.....I cannot see how both things are related.....I am sure you recall footage from the second world war which showed top Nazi officials going to mass before engaging in their crazy killing spree....

It is also true that a number of priests helped jews to escape the death camps but one cannot deny that other priests, particauly in Croatia and Poland, helped the Ustase, a Nazi backed organization in the set up of concentration camps........Moreover, documents show that certaain catholic priests were still preaching from the pulpit that Jews are evil because they rejected the christ and they are to blame for their own demise. In the meantime Jews were buring in hell (i mean in Aushwitz ).....Interesting to know that pope Pus never condemed the holocaust...He was more interested in safeguarding the concordat with Hitler than precious Jewish life.......

AS i said before this is not to show that Christians are bad people but it is to highlight that malicious acts are performed by people irrespective of their beleives

Wally Vella-Zarb

Dec 26th 2011, 18:39

I think that you are confusing cause and effect. You also seem to be confusing Islam with Judaism, Muslims with Jews...

john vella

Dec 26th 2011, 18:58

David Farrugia
Allow me to add that when they find themselves in the minority these people call foul or say they are discriminated, once they gain the majority they blow themselves to please Allah. So now we have it. Allah create and they seem to enjoy to blow what Allah made into existence.

David Farrugia

Dec 26th 2011, 18:59

No I'm not. I'm only referring to the Muslims. The Jews can shun all the bacon they want. They usually don't go about killing people (unless provoked, of course)

Joseph Calleja

Dec 26th 2011, 19:29

@ John Vella, you got it all wrong. They blow themselves to get to the 21 virgins and has nothing to do with pleasing Allah.

Wally Vella-Zarb

Dec 26th 2011, 19:39

David Farrugia, yes you are still confusing things. It is the Jewish Orthodox man who will shun a woman "if she's simply menstruating". As for being "provoked", what worse provocation can there be than to have your land stolen under the preposterous claim that it was promised to somebody else by his 'god'? That is how this whole sorry story started, back in 1947. Perhaps you are too young to remember.

Mr Joe Camilleri

Dec 26th 2011, 19:45

David Borg:
"can't even enjoy a good glass of wine and some nice pork roast "

Joseph Calleja
"They blow themselves to get to the 21 virgins "

No wonder they blow themselves at every opportune moment.

David Farrugia

Dec 26th 2011, 22:19

Wally, yes I'm quite young, but I know some history. The mess of 1947 and the plight of the innocent Palestinians, deprived of their homeland is known to me. However, not all Muslims are Palestinians, certainly not the ones in Nigeria, or the ones in Iraq, Iran, Indonesia and Afghanistan.

john vella

Dec 27th 2011, 06:55

@ David Farrugia
Please add to your list Egypt, Lybia, Palestine of course not Bethlehem because they make a living on the Christian Community although they keep them as second class as they used to do to us in the past here in Malta when they were in the majority.
@Joseph Calleja
You forgot to add the virgins will hang around by the river (I guess to wash themselves) wer there is Palm trees and the land is all green.

Wally Vella-Zarb

Dec 26th 2011, 18:48

The same page to which you linked has itself another link which you, conveniently, did not bother to follow:

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2010/sep/20/iran-criticises-us-double-standards?INTCMP=ILCNETTXT3487

I believe that the United States is largely 'Christian'...

Mr C Busuttil

Dec 26th 2011, 17:56

L-anqas il-basics tibqax tparla u tinharaqx man !!!! keep cool Mark Borg hawn fuq elf hawn Malta LOL dak guts

Off course I heard about the inquisition and the crusades but its a pale comparison about what the atheists dictators as Pol Pot, Saddam, Adolph Hitler and Stalin did, therefore its not religion but the human being that commits these acts. You see it so simple dear MARK BORG, Christ never told anyone to kill in his name nor did Buddha, OK ok...... the prophet is an exception

PS- Biex tkun taf ukoll kemm jien ragel fiz-zmien it-thugs tal-lejber ma kontx nahrab ghalkemm kont ghadni pespuz ahseb u ara llum!!!!!!!!!!!

P Bonnici

Dec 26th 2011, 16:32

Ban all religions because of Islam? That's a good one! I have never heard of a Christian, Jewish or Buddhist suicide bomber.

Mr C Busuttil

Dec 26th 2011, 17:13

Tell when Jesus Christ spoke about War and hatred? ejja ha naraw paroli fil-vojt

Wally Vella-Zarb

Dec 26th 2011, 17:33

@ C Busuttil

"I like your Christ. I do not like your Christians. They are so unlike your Christ!"

(Mahatma Gandhi, a pacifist leader if ever there was one).

c p agius

Dec 26th 2011, 19:13

When i read the old testament it's all about wars and blood.....Then i don;t know what happend in the new testament.....God seemed to have changed nature....

Emma Xerri

Dec 26th 2011, 18:39

Islam as it stands cannot be reformed (unlike Christianity or Judaism) therefore the words found in the Koran are there for all time and all people. Apostates have to be killed, unbelievers given the choice to convert or die, women are to be stoned for adultery, etc. Do not make the mistake of moral relativism, make sure you know about Islam first then decide. By the way Ahmadiyya Muslims are considered to be apostates by mainstream Islam and they themselves have been and are at the receiving end of the stick too. But please do not forget that whereas there are good Muslims in so far as they have rejected the violent aspects of their religion either because of a conscious choice or because they are not wholly familiar with its teachings, there is no good Islam. A good web site to learn more about this religion:
www. Jihadwatch.org

Mr C Busuttil

Dec 26th 2011, 15:16

The old Testament has been superceded by the NEW Testament that is Jesus Christ and his teachings, NOT EVEN THE BASICS. Misquoting from the bible without knowing that Catholics are bound to the New Testament and the Gospel makes you Out of subject.

There are two versions of the Koran, the first when the prophet was a powerless guy and he spoke about love and tolerance. The second version was when he got power in which murdering, rape, slavery etc are permitted. Islam was founded in violence was spread through violence and keeps living in violence. The founder of that religion found nothing wrong in marrying a 6 year old girl and having sex with her!!!!!! He led armies, executed Jews etc. Now Compare him with Christ ?

PS- Compare him with Jesus therefore no excuses with what the Popes did, I am refering to the founders of islam and christianity. The answer for all the murders we witness now is in the founders or better in one of them.

Zagroma Savrene

Dec 26th 2011, 15:23

thank you for pointing yet another flaw in the precious bible believers adore so much. Maybe one day they will address the many flaws that can be found in the bible.

John Ungaro

Dec 26th 2011, 16:07

Yet more antisemitism from Mr Cassar. A person who relies upon events of the very distant past has no valid arguments to make witrh regards to the present. Why not quote the Quran regarding the distruction of the 'infidells'?
Your disassociation from 'such a god' is your loss. I pity you.

Carmel Gatt

Dec 26th 2011, 16:45

C Busuttil says that the New Testament supercedes the Old. Apparently his God is evolving. What next, God on Facebook ?

Mr C Busuttil

Dec 26th 2011, 17:11

Carmel Gatt

Taf x'nidhaq fqajtni.... .

Jesus Christ is the founder of Christianity and he got rid of many customs of the law of Moses because he was GOD and therfore could do so. Otherwise we will still be throwing stones at some adultress and in these days we will have a great number of targets!!!!!!!
Christ ruled against divorce while Moses permitted it. Christ broke the customs of the Jews such as going into the house of a Pagan. Etc etc
The new Pact between mankind and God is clearly stated when Christ says he will bring down the temple and rebuilt it in 3 days. He died and redeemed us and built a his church on Simon the rock.

The old testament is for the Jews while christians have the New one. It is called basics!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Emma Xerri

Dec 26th 2011, 18:58

Martin you have got this all wrong.

Although the Old Testament has a lot of violent episodes, it is not taken as instruction on how to act and live your life, by Jews and Christians. In fact, both Jews and Christians have evolved and created religions based on love and charity, whereas Islam stuck to its violent passages as the immutable and unchanging word of God.

The Koran too talks about love and kindness, but not many know that the more violent verses are the ones that are the guiding spirit of Islam since the explicit instruction in the Koran states that the later verses (which were utter by Mohammed when he became a successful warlord in Mecca) abrogate the earlier non-violent teachings from his years as a relative unknown in Medina. So please stop your 'tu quoque' arguments because they do not stand up to the light of reason.

And your constant harangues about Zionism ring hallow, especially when one considers the number (which runs into the millions) of murdered victims that the so called "Religion of Peace" has extracted since its inception around fourteen hundred years ago and is still doing to this day.

Martin Cassar

Dec 26th 2011, 19:40

@ Emma Xerri
In fact, both Jews and Christians have evolved and created religions based on love and charity, whereas Islam stuck to its violent passages as the immutable and unchanging word of God.

Perhaps this is why we today we see countless number of 'peace-lover 'Christian troops invading, stealing, and killing innocents Muslims?

Are these bunch of your loved terrorists (the Zionists not the Jews) that you have been associating them with Christianity?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hefIti-uFUo&feature=related

Emma Xerri

Dec 27th 2011, 22:18

Martin, as I said before, you do not distinguish between what a religion teaches and what individuals or groups do because they have free will.

How convenient is it to forget that eh?

Christians have been wrong and have killed yes, and in doing so they went against the precepts of their religion and committed sin. No so with Islam - that violence is mandated against all un-believers and that it is the duty to spread Islam by the sword until all the world is subdued and is in submission to the desert moon god - Allah.

And what is your point about Zionists, i.e. Jews that went back to the Holy Land? For your information, there has been an uninterrupted Jewish presence in the Holy Land since recorded history, indigenous Jews and indiginous Arabs lived side by side for hundreds of years - you see, the Semites are the indiginous people of this area. It is only since the arrival of Islam that Arabs have been turned against their brothers the Jews - they are both children of Abraham. No wonder Hitler was such a great fan of Islam, another fascist creed, so much so that he and the grand Mufti of Jerusalem had quite the relationship and that Nazi criminals were sent down to the Middle East, acquired arabic names and trained the arabs in Jew hatred. Check the history for yourself.

M. Schembri

Dec 26th 2011, 12:21

Who is following the koran word for word? The terrorists? Then they better invest in reading glasses since the koran strictly prohibits killing innocent people and killing one is considered the equivalent of killing all the people of the world.

Graham Holme

Dec 26th 2011, 13:18

Over 80 sharia courts now in operation in the U.K.The writing is on the wall

Graham Holme

Dec 26th 2011, 14:20

M Scembri
What koran have you been reading?

KORAN commands to kill infidels:

Allah is an enemy to unbelievers. - Sura 2:98

On unbelievers is the curse of Allah. - Sura 2:161

Slay them wherever ye find them

elmi kader

Dec 26th 2011, 15:42

Graham Holme

from where u bring these defination? is not true you translated how u want. sorry to say that!
the word" ISLAM" means peace.


thanks

Mr C Busuttil

Dec 26th 2011, 17:26

@ elmi kader

Islam means submission not peace, Try another one.......

PS- Submission must be intended by some muslims as by all means even on those who give a hoot on what the prophet says

Graham Holme

Dec 26th 2011, 18:01

elmi kader.
Islam means peace?
Like saying Adolf Hitler.means I love the Jewish people

Emma Xerri

Dec 26th 2011, 19:03

@M Schembri

I feel that I have to point out that whereas you are correct in stating that Islam prohibits the killing of innocent people, most people do not known that the only 'innocent' people are Muslims and that by definition all non-Muslims are NOT innocent because they have rejected Islam. So the terrorists do not need reading glasses, they are acting in accordance with Islamic teachings.

Check more information on: www.jihadwatch.org

Trevor Lorenzo Mizzi

Dec 26th 2011, 22:41

@ elmi kader,

An Arabic word only has one root. The root word for Islam is “al-Silm,” which means “submission” or “surrender.” There is no disagreement about this among Islamic scholars. al-Silm (submission) does not mean the same thing as al-Salaam (peace), otherwise they would be the same word.

Submission and peace can be very different concepts, even if a form of peace is often brought about through forcing others into submission. As the modern-day Islamic scholar, Ibrahim Sulaiman, puts it, "Jihad is not inhumane, despite its necessary violence and bloodshed, its ultimate desire is peace which is protected and enhanced by the rule of law."

In truth, the Quran not only calls Muslims to submit to Allah, it also commands them to subdue people of other religions until they are in a full state of submission to Islamic rule. This has inspired the aggressive history of Islam and its success in conquering other cultures.

Pauline Abela

Dec 26th 2011, 11:53

Perhaps, because violence often brings power? It should be noted that Ahmadiyya is known for its moderate brand of Islam and its members are often themselves persecuted in countries such as Indonesia.

It is commendable that they have spoken up. May they continue to do so.

Unfortunately, the problem with religions seems to be that those who believe in them are SURE believing is their ticket to heaven therefore whatever they do on Earth is acceptable provided it's done in the name of religion.

What I don't understand is: How come any fervent Catholic, Muslim, Christian, etc believes that the OTHERS won't be going to heaven but they are because they believe. It doesn't add up.

Haroon ali

Dec 26th 2011, 12:24

Mr Vella, it is not Islam that is violent. Of course, Sharia punishments are what they are, but these are only to be applied to drug dealers, rapists, adulterers, thieves, etc.

I am a practicing Muslim, and I can garauntee you that Islam, or Allah Himself, does not justify such crazy acts of violence, These ignorant people just bring Islam and all us Muslims to shame.

I ask that you do not consider these acts anything other than random acts of a totally misguided group of people.

Joseph Camilleri

Dec 26th 2011, 14:12

Muslim people are those most kind people i've ever met... Show them that you are a good person, and you have won them for life...

The problem in this world are not people who have Islam faith, or those who are Christian, Buddist and so on and so forth...

There is however a land in the Middle East, which is stolen from it's rightful owners... The problem of this world lies there, and the people who stole that land! Once the powers which they have to control the world are gone, the world will be a MUCH better place to live on.

Remember the 30's??

Graham Holme

Dec 26th 2011, 14:32

Sharia punishments?
Stone to death for adultery,amputation for theft,ect
Haroon ali.you state Islam is not violent?
Random acts of violence? Well your definition of the word random must differ from mine.
Not a day passes without some report,or reports on the news in the media of some barbaric act of violence perpetrated by the followers of Islam.
Islam is not violent,?"The Religion of peace"Islams definition of peace must be entirely different to mine,,,

michael scicluna

Dec 26th 2011, 14:51

replying to haroon ali

so adulterers are the same as drug dealers and rapists? and is a male adulterer equivalant to a female one? muslims all around the world preach that killing is a sin but while catholics love in the name of god.....muslims kill in his name!

Haroon ali

Dec 26th 2011, 16:20

Mr Scicluna Mr.Holme (and I mean Mr. sincerely, not being sarcastic)
Agreed, the punishments are harsh. But pls put yourself in the shoes of a victim here.

All praise be to Allah, that I have not been a victim of infidelity(as far as I know :)).
Nor have I lost a brother/son/daughter to drugs.
Nor have I been raped!!

But to truly rid society of these diseases, we really need to scare the perpetrators, and let the punishment fit the crime.
No need to get into statistics of how many robberies/rapes/drug-related deaths/families torn by infidelities
happen every minute/hour/day...

Even if any of the above happen to even 1 person, it is bad enough. I did not mean to shock anyone,
I just believe extreme situations require extreme measures.

Graham Holme

Dec 26th 2011, 18:08

Haroon ali
By your statement you have not been raped? I take it you are female?
So a female gets raped,under Islamic,sharia law,she must produce four male witnesses,to verify said rape
If unable to do so,she will be then the perpetrator of said rape,and put to death.

Pauline Abela

Dec 26th 2011, 23:00

@Haroon Ali, How do you KNOW what Allah does and does not justify? Isn't that a very arrogant statement? That sort of attitude is what is wrong with religions and religious people. Every strongly religious person I've met - no matter the religion - thinks that they are right, despite the fact that since their beliefs are contradictory, no more than one of them can possibly be right. That is simply logic.

You mentioned Sharia law in relation to drug dealers, rapists, adulterers and thiefs. While it is hard to find justification for the first two categories, I am sure that there is plenty of justifiable reasons while people become both adulterers and thiefs. For example, let's take a country that is so badly managed that people must steal to survive. Why is it wrong for a starving person to steal from someone who has gained excessively from, say, being favoured by someone in power? In relation to adulterers, why do you presume that it is the 'adulterers' fault that he/she pursued another relationship? Is it not possible that the 'adulterers' life was close to hell but for whatever reasons that person was unable to leave the relationship (perhaps even threat of violence).

I think the biggest problems with religious people are that:
1. They believe they are definately right therefore they will go to 'heaven' no matter what.
2. They prefer to regurgitate what they've been told rather than use their brains to assess information and
3. They are too quick to judge

It is good to see that the Ahmadiyya leadership is willing to take a stand and speak up when it believes that a wrong has been done.

Speaking up against evil is the ONLY way to curtail it.

As Edmund Burke said: 'All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing.'

Emma Xerri

Dec 28th 2011, 00:01

@Haroon Ali

Just because individual Muslim such as yourself choose to ignore the violent passages in the Koran and just follow the earlier peaceful writings, does not in any way negate the fact the Islam preaches violence against unbelievers and the submission of infidels.

As far as Sharia punishments go (and with these you seem to have no problems with - adultery is a crime deserving of physcial punishment or death and so is apostasy or blasphemy. That none of these supposed crimes are criminal offences in liberal western democracies seems to have escaped your attention)!! You do not seem to mind that cruel and barbaric punishments according to Islamic Shariah law not only goes against our common humanity but are in themselves proof of the blood lust and violence inherent in Islam and what is more, this can never be changed - since as you agree, the Koran is the perfect and immutable word of God.

Finally, then if these are the few act of a few misguided people, how come I can supply you with list after list of atrocities and violents acts committed by your co-religionists in the name of Islam in country after country after country. Islam is as Islam does and from what I can see, where Islam goes, blood is sure to follow. I judge by what I see and not by hearsay.

Francis Bonello

Dec 26th 2011, 13:05

Well said, Mr Caruana