‘You have to put my people in’

Nationalist Sliema councillor Yves (Bobby) Calì has “strongly” denied the report carried on Monday in which he backed the former mayor’s claim that MP Robert Arrigo interfered over the dismissal of a contracts manager employed by the council.

But today The Times is publishing the transcript of a 14-minute telephone interview with Mr Calì, 63, carried out last week, which shows that the report faithfully reflected what he told this newspaper.

“You cannot come and impose, ‘these people are mine and you have to put them in’, as though you’re the only one in Sliema,” he said, alluding to Mr Arrigo’s attitude towards the council.

The interview revolved around a claim made in a police interrogation by former mayor Nikki Dimech, that Mr Arrigo had asked the council to favour “his people” for jobs and tried to persuade the then mayor not to sack the contracts manager, Stephen Buhagiar.

Information about the interrogation emerged in the testimony of Police Inspector Angelo Gafà in the first hearing of Mr Dimech’s bribery court case. Mr Arrigo has categorically denied Mr Dimech’s allegations.

In a statement issued on Monday night, Mr Calì said the story PN Backs Councillor’s Claim About MP’s Interference was incorrect and “misquoted me completely on this point as in no way does it reflect what I told The Times...”

He added: “I never said that Mr Arrigo put any pressure on me to employ his people with the council; Mr Arrigo never insisted with me on ‘having one of his supporters kept in the employ of the Sliema council’, as The Times reported.

‘There was a lot of pressure’

“He never put any pressure on me, nor did he ever approach me before the vote was taken regarding Stephen Buhagiar’s employment. He only expressed his disagreement after the vote was taken.”

When The Times had asked Mr Calì about Mr Dimech’s claim that the MP wanted the council to favour “his people”, Mr Calì said: “I wasn’t there when he (Mr Arrigo) told him that, no, but I assume he did since he wanted to put this one in (contractor Stephen Buhagiar) and he made such a fuss about it with me.”

Asked if Mr Arrigo had insisted on this, Mr Calì said: “Of course...”

In Monday’s story, The Times said that, after the council dismissed Mr Buhagiar (Mr Arrigo’s former driver), Mr Arrigo complained and the matter had to be settled at party level.

It added that an annoyed Mr Calì brought the issue up with Mr Arrigo in front of Mr Dimech, confirming what the latter told the police.

Mr Calì explained to The Times that when the issue was taken up to party level, the PN agreed Mr Buhagiar should have been dismissed. “But there was a lot of pressure in the meantime,” he added.

During the interview, Mr Calì also stressed that he always wanted to ensure the Sliema council was not treated as anyone’s “private club” and compared Mr Arrigo’s behaviour within Sliema to that of a minister within his ministry.

Transcript of the telephone interview with Yves (Bobby) Calì

You were mentioned in today’s report (the article published on Thursday, September 23, reporting Nikki Dimech’s allegations) and I think it’s only fair to get your views on the matter.

Let me tell you, Chris. The fact is that what was said today is part of the argument of (police inspector Angelo) Gafà... something Nikki had said under interrogation. Basically it’s true...

And what’s the situation, how did it get resolved? What happened exactly?

We ended up before the party... As Nikki said, effectively...

So you did feel Robert was putting undue pressure on the situation?

Um... I wasn’t happy with it, yes, I wasn’t happy with it...

...So what happened, with Robert? You happened to be there? Or you walked in on them?

No, it wasn’t that time. It was another occasion with Robert. It wasn’t the meeting that he (Nikki) is mentioning, that’s why I said it was almost all true. He confused it... He had an argument with Robert and the other one (Stephen Buhagiar)... I think he did, because that’s what he had told me about it. But then I met with Robert coincidentally and he (Nikki) was there and I brought it up...

...Did you feel uncomfortable with Robert’s kind of interference?

Not uncomfortable. He was insisting... like he did with Nikki. And I’m not that kind of person, I’m sorry...

That’s trading in influence when you think about it...

Look, it happens all the time by all parties, everyone wants to put in their own people. But then there’s a limit... the type of people you want to put in. If this one was lazy, and did nothing... My point was always, from day one, that we are there to help all MPs, from both sides obviously, we help ours and Labour help theirs.

You mean residents, right?

No, no, even MPs. Because MPs have their own needs for the residents. Let’s say Robert has someone complaining because they are throwing rubbish in front of his door. In this case, I will serve Robert. But you cannot come and impose, “these people are mine and you have to put them in”, as though you’re the only one in Sliema, forget it. No, we want to put people who are... people who should be happy in that job, not because they are of this person or that one. Forget it. And then, at the detriment of someone who could be good.

It should be a public decision...

That’s how it was in fact (the decision to dismiss Stephen Buhagiar)... People used to tell me, isn’t he (Stephen Buhagiar) meant to be doing our work? How is he going around in Robert’s car? And Robert’s argument was that he didn’t have fixed hours with us... Once I saw him myself, driving around in Robert’s car and it’s not on... It doesn’t look good. Even if there’s nothing illegal in it... Maybe I’m old school.

I don’t think it’s old school. I think it’s fair.

But this is my point and that’s why I decided I wanted to speak to you, first of all because how long can I remain silent? And secondly, I did not want to come across as arrogant (supperv).

But now you’ve been mentioned by name... There’s nothing negative.

Negative, definitely not. It shows the opposite. I complained about it. The other two who complained (about Stephen Buhagiar) were Cyrus (Engerer) and Joanna (Gonzi).

So do you confirm this claim that Nikki made under interrogation that Robert told him to choose his people?

I wasn’t there when he told him that, no, but I assume he did since he wanted to put this one (Stephen Buhagiar) in and he made such a fuss about it with me.

So he was quite hard about it, he insisted on it?

Robert? Of course.

And how did the party deal with it? What was the compromise?

The compromise was nothing. I showed, from the minutes, the reasons why we removed him and they agreed we were right.

So your point was vindicated by the party?

Yes, but there was a lot of pressure in the meantime.

And this is almost common practice that everyone tries to help his own...

I’m not saying that myself. You can realise it’s like that. When you go into a ministry, you find the minister’s people not those of someone else, no? So don’t put words in my mouth.

No, fair enough, that’s why I’m asking you again, because what you said before could have been interpreted like that.

The truth is that if you look around you, if you’re a minister, it’s your people you put in there. So if he does not have a ministry....

But this is more serious, this isn’t his ministry...

Yes true. Look, I didn’t want to keep the Sliema local council a club for one, full stop. It is there for everyone, for the people...

And Robert has nothing to do with it...

He does because he’s from Sliema. But you cannot assume... I mean, when he was mayor himself, fair enough, it’s up to him. But when we came (were elected), the thing I mostly didn’t want was that any one of them... whoever... made it their private club full stop.

But it almost felt like that? At times you felt he was making it his private club?

When you realise that the majority of the staff came during his time. There are a lot of things that tie in. He was there twice. Then there was (Albert Bonello) Dupuis and then his wife (Marina Arrigo). So...

They were deep-rooted these ties...

Of course. If you’re there for that long and then there’s just one person and then there’s your wife instead... And then he put Nikki, he was pushing Nikki because he was his protégé... So there was a situation he wanted to maintain, when it didn’t continue he wasn’t happy.