Baby drowns in baptism in Moldova
Police in Moldova are investigating the death of a six-week-old baby who apparently drowned during his baptism.
The boy's relatives said he died after swallowing water during the ceremony last Friday in a village.
In the Orthodox religion, babies are baptised by being briefly immersed three times in water. Priests hold the infant's mouths and noses.
Film shot by relatives shows the baby moving after being taken out of the font, but then suffering difficulty breathing as he is dressed. Twenty minutes later, he started bleeding from his nose and mouth and died.
A church spokeswoman said the priest who performed the baptism was being investigated for manslaughter.
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P. Baldacchino
Jul 29th 2010, 22:50
Baptisim should be carried out on a person when he is 18, so that he will decide if he wants to or not.
G Brewsky
Jul 29th 2010, 13:20
How very very sad this story is.
Let us not make this story a forum from those who seek to make every religion related story into a full on religious, philosophical debte/forum/blog/slagging match.
Instead let's count our lucky stars that we have our friends and our families with us.
Jesmond Mifsud
Jul 29th 2010, 12:55
@M.Caruana
Ok, yes. I agree with you. I lack tact with regards to other people's irrational beliefs. I think it's my responsibility to tell people that they have a mind for a very good reason. We have succeeded as a species, thanks to our rational thinking. When people throw that out of the window, and when you have entire countries basing their laws on these irrationalities, you will end up with disasters of epic proportions. So yes, it is my responsibility to safeguard the future of this planet from religion. Organized religions have had their way for thousands of years, they messed it up and now it's OVER.
I agree with you when you say that it is not my business what people believe in. I wouldn't have a problem if individuals believed in talking snakes or magic underwear if they kept their beliefs private and not impose them on everyone else. But that's not how it works now is it?
Having said that, NOWHERE did I mention that I found the death of this child funny!!
mary borg
Jul 29th 2010, 12:39
@ Jesmond Mifsud
Oh time will tell no worry, who will be laughing. I do understand why you make fun of eternity....just remember my friend that eternity is there whether you like it or not. It just goes on and on and on...for all eternity - quite a long time!!!. It's quite easy to choose where you want to spend it...you choose it now, here on earth while enjoying life! But what am I saying....can I enjoy life and believe in all these 'superstitions'? Maaa what am I saying? Well plain truth...yes you can. You can live life to the fullest , have the most profound joy at the same time choosing life for all eternity and not death for all eternity! I choose life here on earth, I choose life for all eternity, I choose Jesus!
Jesmond Mifsud
Jul 29th 2010, 14:32
@mary borg
I guess the term "ignorance is bliss" would totally apply to you then. It's easy to give in to the delusions thought to us by our Catholic upbringing. I choose to think for myself rather than stick blindly to what the priest tells me. I just wish that all these delusions didn't have to hurt so many people.
Joe Zammit
Jul 29th 2010, 10:10
What is important in the Sacrament of Baptism is water. Immersion is not necessary.
Christ set up SEVEN Sacraments. In each sacrament there are the matter and form. In Baptism the matter is water which has to be poured on the head and the form are the words: I baptize you in the name of the Father, and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit". In other words in every valid baptism the Holy Trinity is invoked.
Baptism opens the way for heaven and the reception of the other Sacraments.
Jesmond Mifsud
Jul 29th 2010, 10:38
Yes Joe Zammit, and while you're at it, you should also wave a magic wand over the head of the person being baptized, sing "Twinkle Twinkle little star" and rub one hand over your tummy and the other over your head. Make sure that you don't miss any of these steps or the loving magic-daddy will burn the person being baptized in hell for all eternity.
Oh, making fun of the religious is too easy but feels soooo good :D
A. Zahra
Jul 29th 2010, 11:18
@ J.M. - Illl taf x'nidħaq bħalissa! pfff
Jesmond Mifsud
Jul 29th 2010, 11:26
@A. Zahra
Well what can I say? If you don't want people making fun of your beliefs, maybe you shouldn't believe in such funny things.
M.Caruana
Jul 29th 2010, 11:29
@ Jesmond Mifsud.
Ha Ha HA. Oh how we're laughing Mr Mifsud! So 'making fun of the religious' is the ONLY way you get your kicks I see. You.... who in this heat,like us mortals of course, smell, stink, sit on the toilet, sneeze, spit , get sick, die and finally rot and decay into dirt!....you still want to make fun...because a baby died during a religious ceremony, How sad and sick..
Jesmond Mifsud
Jul 29th 2010, 12:09
@M.Caruana
I think that the best way to defeat religion is to show people how ridiculous religious claims are. Truth is that if religion has not been so destructive on societies throughout human history, it would be extremely hilarious. What happened to this baby was another tragic product of religion. If the parents of this child had only realized how ridiculous and unnecessary this ritual was, then there would be one less dead child in the world. you obviously care more about traditions and superstitions than the lives of people, so you don't get to say that I'm the one who lacks tact.
M.Caruana
Jul 29th 2010, 12:36
@ Jesmond Mifsud,
You cannot 'show people how ridiculous religious claims are' because you're not in their shoes and it's not your business what they believe in. One thing I agree with you is that throughout history people used and still do use, the name of God to destroy and cause pain and death to others who don't agree with their religious beliefs. And THAT 'S the only thing I agree with you. But it's not polite to mock and call ridiculous and hilarious someone else' s belief. Do you have children Mr. Mifsud? I don't think so. Because if you did, you wouldn't have found this tragedy 'hilarious' , irrelevant how this baby died ok, people die in all different circumstances, unfortunately this one died during a religious ceremony. And don't underestimate our intelligence and try to turn things around now please. You've made your first comment and you showed your lack of respect towards religions. So Mr Mifsud, yes you lack tacts.
Kevin Cassar
Jul 29th 2010, 14:21
@ M Caruana
This is not an accidental tragedy but a blatantly stupid act that cost the life of a baby. Anyone who has a little sense will know that humans cannot breathe under water because we do not have gills. Holding a baby under water, is like putting your hand in fire - you cannot expect not to get burnt. The fact that other babies who were "bapitzed" this way did not die is just a lucky coincidence.
@ Joe Zammit
you quote : "What is important in the Sacrament of Baptism is water. Immersion is not necessary. "
Silly me!!! I used to think that what's important in Baptism is the Holy spirit. Now I know better.
A. Zahra
Jul 29th 2010, 18:39
@ J.M. - Biex turi kemm int matur. Jien għandi ħbieb li jemmnu u oħrajn li ma jemmnux. Ma jfissirx li dawk li ma jemmnux noqgħod nidħaq bihom imma nirrispetahom. Jekk għalik ma jogħġbokx li tkun Nisrani għamel int, imma ħalli lil oħrajn li jemmnu jagħmlu huma mhux titmejjel bihom.
Kevin Cassar
Jul 29th 2010, 20:42
@ A Zahra
What you are saying to Jesmond Mifsud is a very big misconception from ignorance. Respecting the people who have different beliefs is ok, but that does not mean you have to respect their beliefs. If I were to say that the universe was created by a purple spotted orange caterpillar who lives in my invisible garden, would you respect my belief or would you discard it for the nonsense it is? Do you respect the beliefs of hijackers who shout Allah akbar and who believe they are fulfilling God's will when killing passengers and blowing up planes?? I would think not.
renald williams
Jul 28th 2010, 10:41
Baptism is immersion, for grown ups, we become spiritual children of God by faith,
dying children go to heaven. peace health
U malli tghammed, Gesu’ minnufih hareg mill-ilma. Matthew 3:16., Mark 1:10
Gwanni wkoll kien ighammed f’Ghajnun qrib Salim, ghax kien hemm hafna ilma hemm: u kienu jigu u jitghammdu. John 3:23.
Mghammdin minnu fix-xmara tal-Gurdan, billi jistqarru… Mark 1:5
Ghallmu l-gnus u ghammduhom... U ghallmuhom iharsu kulma ordnajtilkom.
Matthew 28:19, 20.
Min jemmen u jitghammed… Mark 16:16.
wlied Alla; lil dawk li jemmnu f’ismu. John 12-13.
Jekk ma tikkonvertux, u ssiru bhal tfal zghar, ma tidhlux fis-saltna tas-smewwiet.
Matthew 18:3.
Tfal ckejknin… ta’ dawn hija s-saltna t’Alla. Mark 10:14-15; Luke 18:16-17; Matthew 19:14.
Qalilhom Gesu’: Iva: qatt ma qrajtu: Minn fomm it-tfal u t-trabi int sahhaht it-tifhir?
Matthew 21:16.
Melissa Bagley
Jul 28th 2010, 11:04
Yes, baptism is for adults who make a conscious decision to join the Church - agreed. Not for babies.
Mario camilleri
Jul 28th 2010, 10:16
Bla sens,Ghara naqra kemm qedin sewwa.Mela meta kont zighir tal musew kinu jaghlmuna li tarbija mhux maghmda tmur il limbu,Ghara kif jista alla jibata il limbu tarbija li ma tahti xejn.Din il knisja ghanda bzonn hasla min isfel sa fuq ,qass kristu ma taghmed ta xaghar imma meta kellu 30 sena jaqaw il knisja tibza li jekk it trabbi ma namduwhomx jonqsu il membri u ofjament il buisness jonqos.
P Borg
Jul 28th 2010, 21:05
Mr Camilleri, you said the right thing. It's all a business matter.
Believing in God & doing what feels right inside is what matters not all these money making rituals. What sins do children have, especially babies? People need to open their eyes. The Church in the old days used to make up all these lies which people always believed. These days at least a lot of people use heir own brain to think & don't let the church preach all this nonsense.
Tony Abela
Jul 29th 2010, 07:42
Nahseb Sur. Camilleri Ilek ftit li tlaqt mill-Museum ghax it-taghalim aggorna llum. Iccekja ftit it-taghlim li hareg l-papa ftit taz-zmien ilu fuq il-limbu.
Abela J
Jul 29th 2010, 10:18
@Tony Abela
Pero' il-kredu baqa l-istess u l-limbu ghadu jissemma..
Michael De Giovanni
Jul 29th 2010, 14:15
Dak ghaliex fil - malti ma ghadniex translation tajba ghal- "inferi" li m'hiex infern imma bl-ingliz jew descended into the dead jew descended into hades.
Anthony Pulis
Jul 29th 2010, 14:38
Mario Camilleri
Ghandek ragun tghid li l-limbu baqa jissemma fil-kredu. Madankollu, le, t-taghlim mhux l-istess. Hallini nispjegalek ftit u nispera li tifhimni. Mela, il-Knisja QATT ma kellha taghlim DOMMATIKU li jghid li tarbija li tmut minghajr ma tircievi l-maghmudija tmur il-Limbu. U l-Papa Benedittu XVI ma harigx jikkuntrarja xi taghlim passat imma sempliciment di li kienet opinjoni popolari. Issa il-Limbu tal-Kredu??? Mela fil-kredu nghidu li Kristu nizel fil-Limbu. Qabel Kristu miet, dawk li kienu jsalvaw, xorta ma setghux imorru l-Genna u kienu jmorru fil-Limbu. Mhux l-istess Limbu li l-Papa qal li ma jezistix. Ir-raguni hi li ahna l-Maltin uzajna kelma wahda ghaz-zewg kuncetti. F'lingwi ohra hemm zewg termini. Pero serrah rasek illi l-Limbu msemmi fil-Kredu m'ghandux x'jaqsam ma' dak tat-trabi.
Anthony Pulis
Jul 29th 2010, 15:34
Hadt zball meta indirizzajt il-kumment tieghi lis-Sur Camilleri. Il-kumment kellu jkun ghal J. Abela. Il-kumment ta' Michael De Giovanni u li ghaddejt jiena jikkumplimentaw lil xulxin
Joss Galea
Jul 28th 2010, 07:59
Isaw these types of baptisms here in Malta, and I didn't like them at all. Why do you have to immerse a tiny baby in the water?!!