Committee to discuss definition of obscenities

d.attard

Jan 21st 2010, 18:10

dear mr battistino, i have travelled to our north and south and never came across the kind of roads we have to suffer...good roads are possible, i have visited eu nations having an all inclusive education system...even this is very possible, the quality of air is significantly superior to ours, hence even better quality of air is very possible, waste seperation has been introduced long ago and is effective, hence even this is very possible, i have been to these countries where all members in failed marriages can commit themselves in marriage and so do not need to have children out of weadlock, hence even this is possible, have enjoyed cultural events for a mature audience, hemce even this is possible...so sir, what i suggest is not only very possible, but has been enjoyed by so many others for ages: remember our expectations when we voted for entry into the eu?...but as i say, i also know people who live in favellas who live a happy life needing nothing more...so bully on you that you are so well contented and who may consider having decent roads and clean air as an impossibiliy...take care and wish you all the best

V Battistino

Jan 21st 2010, 17:13

@ D Attard I quote William Faulkner : "All of us failed to match our dreams of perfection. So I rate us on the basis of our splendid failure to do the impossible." ...now you may resume your search...and I wait for the debate to start on this new definition of obscenity !

d.attard

Jan 21st 2010, 15:05

dear mr battistino,

you seem to have this habit of assuming all over the place and then proceed to go at terrible tangents based on your unilateral assumptions.

well, it is not just me that finds incumbent lacking...it is the majority of those who voted in the last election...remember that incumbent only enjoys a relative majority.

now this is neither here nor there if we could experience a normal life that one expects from any average government.

that we search for much better soultions is driven by the obvious weaknesses experienced by those who know better. seraching does not make one anti or pro any party...it just makes that person alive.

now if you are happy with our fare, hey that is super and bully for you...

V Battistino

Jan 21st 2010, 13:12

@ d attard

you seem to come out of a textbook !

but noticing that you are referring to the incumbent government as not fulfilling your aspirations and also stating that you are not a PL spokesman, then I take it that you must be siding with any other party in Malta which has never come up with practical solutions good enough to be elected in Gov't for these last 50 years !

unfortunately such parties remained in the clouds....

ps...and get my surname right, i'm not the argentine football star :)

V Battistino

Jan 21st 2010, 13:05

@ K Cassar

1. the editor of realta' never placed classification to protect minors from reading adult material.....it was distributed free on campus finding its way wherever. There was never any indication of the content , hence, the recipients were never 'warned'. He could have handed a loaded weapon without notice that it was actually loaded.

2. obviously a two year old cannot read, but if it was images or video, well then she could see it.....and the medium does not matter at all.....but again, do you say that such articles are safe with 16 year olds ?

3. what's your point ? everyone who will be contributing on the issue must have also read the article........are you putting them in 'bad' light as you seem to be putting me in ? what do you implicate ? did you read it ? i wouldn't be surpirised otherwise I wouldn't expect you to be participating in this dialogue.....

I just cannot see how you accept that something which should have been better controlled by putting it on the top shelf like other pornographic material was distributed around to one and sundry......that's all ! ......editorial responsibility !

Kenneth Cassar

Jan 21st 2010, 10:21

@ V Battistino:

"1. the programme will be rated AO.......is this not a form of censorship ?".

No, since the programme will be aired. That is not censorship, but classification to protect minors from watching or listening to adult material.

"2. ...and Hon Bonnici is quoted below as not allowing his daughter read the article. is this not censorship ?".

No, not if his daughter is a minor.

"3. i got a copy of the student paper from an eighteen year old university student , who might have felt really exaulted as having had the privilege of reading pornography for free, in a public place ...... is this what we mean by freedom of expression?"

And the question is...did you read the pornography? If not, how do you know it was pornography? If yes...well...you know the rest.

I really think we need to grow up and start behaving like adults!

J.Borg

Jan 21st 2010, 09:26

@ ernest vella:
"@ The Labour Party
If you want to win the next election, don't tread on our traditional values."

We need to keep traditional vallues.....but to take a youth to court for an article...which noone knew about it and now everybody wants to read it.....because the rector stopped the Realta circulation....things have been blown out of proportion on this.

We are saying that this article is obscene...when our children can go on the internet and find all kind of obscenities.

We aren't talking about young children...but mature youths...and one can only guide them to what is right or wrong but you cannot stop them from browsing the internet!!!!!!

Ramon Casha

Jan 21st 2010, 06:16

@A. Sciberras: Thanks for pointing out what the actual law says. As written, all crime novels are illegal. All horror films are illegal. Anything depicting cruelty and violence is illegal. Under this law, the film "Passion of the Christ" was illegal on all counts - yet the censorship board saw fit to give it a rating of 12!!

CFarrugia

Jan 21st 2010, 04:37

Dr John Zammit
your statement in any other european country one can buy pornography in any stationary, I do not agree with that, i have been living in Germany ten years, for pornography there are extra shops or extra sections in DVD or video rental shops which are only for persons over 18, definitely no stationary shop where children go in and out all the time. there are some magazines in stationaries depicting nudes, but they are NOT pornographic.

Joseph Sammut

Jan 21st 2010, 02:51

@Dr. John Zammit: good question. I hope that you know the answer and wasn't one of the thousands who just said YES because that is what was required of them.

Joseph Anthony Xuereb

Jan 21st 2010, 02:40

the maltese parliament is the most two faced in europe.swearing in public is so common at football matches,water polo and in general maltese life that you would have to put 98 percent of the maltese population in gaol.stop wasting our time and to something real.i bet most of us guys,including myself,has watched porn and swore.malta is the joke country of europe

d.attard

Jan 20th 2010, 23:54

dear mr battistuta,

I like the way you put words in my mouth. Now why does anyone who comments on government performance is designated to be a LP spokesperson? I am not and do not understand why you adress your questions to me. Yet any Government worth its salt can easily improve on the terrible performance of incumbent as follows:

Increasing revenues by the maximisation of investment potential in untapped areas, and in other crubling areas such as incoming tourism

maximising efficiency at the expenditure end of the spectrum rendering our economy attractive to foreign investment

respect acknowledged international options for a more effective society by, for example, the enhancement of marriage opportunities that will oblidge less members of society to have children out of wedlock

introduce an effectice transport system and a waste disposal system that will lessen drastically pressures on our environment

open doors and windows to creative thinking so that our society will not only encourage those who are unable to tell the difference between censorship and ratings, but all progressives that have so much to contribute towards the development of an all-inclusive society

ensure that our educational process caters for all our children, formalists and informalists...

Ernest Vella

Jan 20th 2010, 22:22

@ Giovan Said -meta ssemmi l-fidi nisranija bl-ebda mod ma mplikajt il-Knisja imma lin-nies li l-boghod minn kull sentiment partigjan u politiku ihobb lill-Knisja Kattolika Rumana...meta semmejt lill-PL l-ebda mod ma qieghed imur lura fil-passat ghax dawk passat...imma nwegga meta il-PL - partit serju jigi jiddefendi din il-publikazzjoni li tinsulta u toffendi lill-Madonna, lill-Alla u lill-Ostja....meta l-istess stazzjon tal-PL bil-prezentatur tant bravu Alfred Zammit qed imexxi kampanja kontra d-daghha u jippromwovi t-talba tar-ruzarju....nahseb xi hadd minnhom mhux qed jirraguna sewwa

Insaqsi...tista inti taghmel kampanja kontra d-daghha bhala PL umbat fl-istess hin taqbel ma daghha u kliem oxenn kontra l-istess haga? Imma int tant mimli mibeghda lejn il-Knisja li ma hsibtx li Alla u l-Madonna m'ghandhomx x'jaqsmu u zlaqt fin-niexef

edward bartolo

Jan 20th 2010, 21:59

If the labour party continues with this, so called, progressive trend, it will find it much harder to win the next general election.

It should be obvious, that most Maltese citizens are irritated by this permissive attitude. The great majority of our people, including myself, are very fond of our traditional values including the Christian values.

@ The Labour Party
If you want to win the next election, don't tread on our traditional values.

C.Sammut

Jan 20th 2010, 21:52

:)) I want to be a fly on the wall during this discussion...!!

Joseph Ellis

Jan 20th 2010, 21:52

Once again the Labour Party is taking the initiative and the Government is being put on the defensive.

I think that this was a very intelligent and highly motivated move by Owen Bonnici. Well done. I also think that the announced arraignment of Mark Camilleri on obscenity charges is going to do untold damage to the credibility of the Nationalist government locally and abroad and further alienate the dwindling band of liberals in the Nationalist Party from their party. The Nationalist Party is increasingly shifting to the right and becoming sectarian in nature and outlook and is no longer the broad church it used to be.

This is an ideological shift which Labour is starting to exploit and may well prove decisive in the next elections. The more the Nationalist Party lets the fundamentalist Catholics within its ranks dominate it and occupy all important government positions, the more it will be out of synch with society in general.

C Bezzina

Jan 20th 2010, 21:29

Owen Bonnici illum wera kemm il-Partit Laburista huwa superficjali. L-ewwel mar bil-gurnalisti quddiem il-Qorti imbaghad meta staqsewh biex jaqra parti mill-artiklu ta' Realta ma riedx ghax mimli kliem oxxen...meta staqsewh jekk jiehux gost li l-artiklu jispicca f'idejn it-tifla tieghu, qal li le ma jiehux gost u kompla li kieku kien hu l-editur ma kienx jippublika l-artiklu !!! - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_HtdXpqgBhw

Mela x' mar jaghmel quddiem il-Qorti ? Biex jidher ?

CGalea

Jan 20th 2010, 21:01

So according to the holy of holies writing in these blogs the book Handmaid's Tale was considered a perfect choice for the MATSEC A Level syllabus?

Alfred Bugeja

Jan 20th 2010, 20:11

@joe e galea

Ahem, owen bonnici went on record in Parliament and in various articles in the papers saying that he wants a total ban on all forms of censorship.

What led him to this toning down today is beyond me.

Dr. John Zammit

Jan 20th 2010, 20:07

In other progressive European countries one can go to any stationery and buy pornography - books, magazines, dvd's etc. Are we going to remain in the dark ages? Why did we become members of the European Union then?

Claire Bonello

Jan 20th 2010, 20:01

Owen Bonnici's daughter is 2 years old. The Realta story may not be suitable reading material for 2 year olds, but I think University and Junior College students can cope with it without having a fainting fit....

tony abela

Jan 20th 2010, 19:28

" Government Reaction - In a reaction, Justice and Home Affairs Minister Carm Mifsud Bonnici said he welcomed the fact that the voice of reason was finally prevailing over political opportunism" contradicts the interpretation given by some of the bloggers who are crying wolf before understanding fully the position of both the Opposition and the Government.

Enough said to the 'spin' bloggers.

A. Sciberras

Jan 20th 2010, 19:15

Folks, the Pornography and Obscenity Regulations of 1975 define an article as obscene or pornographic if:

(a) its dominant characteristic is the exploitation of, or undue emphasis on, sex, or any one of the following subjects, namely, crime, horror, cruelty and violence; or
(b) it directly or indirectly advertises or gives information on any article considered to be pornographic or obscene under these Regulations

Do you honestly believe that an author who emphasizes crime or horror or violence or sex or cruelty in his writing should be sent to prison for 6 months? Horror!?

The true horror is the state we find ourselves in this country at present and the sad people whose criticism is based purely on partisan motives, devoid of any logic or reason. It is nigh time for Maltese citizens who want their country to move forwards and not backwards to take a stand.

V Battistino

Jan 20th 2010, 19:15

@ d attard

using your same contribution....are you saying that the PL will :

1. reduce the number of children born outside marriage ? .... how ?
2. reduce government revenue from a gambling culture and tabacco smoking ?...how ?
3. reduce the abuse of drugs ?....how ?
4. reduce the highest levels of children who do not continue their education post-primary ? ...how ?
5. reduce poverty traps ?...how ?
6. reduce horrible quality of air ?...how ?

How is the labour party at least seen as trying to clear the rubble to find a foundation upon which to build a kinder inclusive society...??? Very clear... by eliminating the democratic election of a party general secretary, for example.... that's very inclusive from the opposition benches !

in a lighter vein, will the 'mambra' monument survive an updated definition? ........ we let PL come up with this ! its got so many bright ideas !

V Battistino

Jan 20th 2010, 19:03

next Friday evening, censorship will be discussed on national TV.....and so would the infamous contribution of Vella Gera...no harm but funnily enough :

1. the programme will be rated AO.......is this not a form of censorship ?

2. the PL leader has been quoted as being against any form of censorship......and Hon Bonnici is quoted below as not allowing his daughter read the article. is this not censorship ?

3. i got a copy of the student paper from an eighteen year old university student , who might have felt really exaulted as having had the privilege of reading pornography for free, in a public place ...... is this what we mean by freedom of expression ?

I really think we need to grow up and start behaving like adults !

Freedom of expression is not freedom to abuse !

R Cassar

Jan 20th 2010, 19:02

I just saw Owen Bonnici on Net News replying to questions by journalists during his press conference today. He was so confusing in his thoughts.

Andrew Gatt

Jan 20th 2010, 18:24

Definiton of obscenities: Easy. It's most of what you hear walking down Republic Street or at a local football/waterpolo match!

;)

R. Caruana

Jan 20th 2010, 18:24

I've just seen Owen Bonnici on TV reply to a journalist's question saying that he would not let his daughter read such an article! Any comments are superfluous as this point.

GiovDeMartino

Jan 20th 2010, 18:23

All those who lived in Malta bet 1971 and 1987 should know prfectly well what obscenities are.

COLIN STANLEY

Jan 20th 2010, 18:01

are some people suggesting that because we jion ed the EU, anything goes, that we should lose our Morals and values , that because we are in the 21st. cent. anything goes is this what we want for our children, I thought that our aim is to leave a better world for them. I am not a saint far from it, but that doesn't mean that I don't want something good for my grandchildren.

Pamela Hansen

Jan 20th 2010, 17:39

Has not the Opposition more serious affairs to attend to? This whole affair has been blown out of all proportion.

Wilf Schonen

Jan 20th 2010, 17:18

The way i see it when it comes to freedom of speach and when it comes to coming out that thick shell of theirs, the Maltese are lagging behind everyone else in europe, however when it comes to making money out of us tourists and visiters alike they surely are not lagging behind as they jump in head first, so what it boils down to is Money.

d.attard

Jan 20th 2010, 17:17

A tree is known from its fruit...the values of incumbent governent are reflected in the number of children born outside marriage, government revenue from a gambling culture and tabacco smoking, abuse of drugs, highest levels of children who do not continue their education post-primary, poverty traps, horrible quality of air, the list is endless...the labour party is at least seen as trying to clear the rubble to find a foundation upon which to build a kinder inclusive society...in a lighter vein, will the 'mambra' monument survive an updated definition?

LINA MANGION

Jan 20th 2010, 17:16

THE EDITOR OF 'REALTA ' IS TO BE ARRAIGNED IN COURT FOR PORNIGRAPHY.
IS THE PERSON WHO PUT ON INTERNET THE WHOLE STORY TO BE ARRAIGNED
TOO. AND IF NOT WHY.

Joe E Galea

Jan 20th 2010, 16:44

To all Nationalist anti-PL whatever the reason: Please before you start shooting read the article well like I did.

Many of you didn't even read the first paragraph which states the obvious: I think the keywords committee, already provided for, to advise should be taken into consideration and in their own context. Could be that in 1975 since there was no internet obscenities regarding this medium are not described, so what's wrong in updating such definitions?

I am sure that Owen Bonnici and the PL are not in favour of removing all censorships and definitely don't believe that anything obscene is ok. I am sure that the agenda of the anti-PL scaremongerers who are always there to cry wolf asa the PL comes up with an initiative, should be the first to be censored as their hypocrisy is obscene. Twisting the meaning of what the PL does and says will ot lead to picture your decadent government in a better light.

Get real and objective in what you say as being a blindfolded partisan just shows why this country is in such a pathetic state!!

GIOVANN SAID

Jan 20th 2010, 16:15

@ Ernest Vella

Il-kumment tieghek ifakkarni f'dawk in-Nazzjonalisti li dejjem ihabbtu fuq sidirhom fl-ewwel bankijiet tal-Knisja imma imbaghad huma mnezza minn kull virtu' u kull ghajnuna lejn iz-zghir u lejn il-batut.

Niftakar ukoll kif sfortunatament, il-Knisja ma timxix ma' kulhadd l-istess. Dan rajnieh car dan l-ahhar. Meta Patri Mark Montebello qal xi haga biex tiddefendi klassi partikolari ta' nies fis-socjeta' u wera certu ideat progressivi li, sfortunament in-nuqqas taghhom qed ikompli jbieghed lin-nies mill-Knisja, il-Knisja kienet pronta u qabzet fuqu biex taghlaqlu halqu. Mill-banda l-ohra, meta dan l-ahhar smajna b'widnejna stess lil Fr. Peter Serracino Inglott jistqarr li hu kien jikteb id-diskorsi tal-mass meetings Nazzjonalisti lil EFA, hemmhekk ma smajna bl-ebda forma ta' censura min-naha tal-Knisja.

Il-poplu ma jistax jafda aktar lil min jimxi mod ma' persuna u mod iehor ma' persuna ohra li tkun wettqet l-istess eghmil! Il-poplu ma jistax jafda aktar lill-partit li ghadu mohhu maghluq... il-PN dejjem ipprova jaghmel kapital mill-Knisja... Il-PL huwa bil-provi l-partit taz-zghazagh u allura ma jistax ma jressaqx ideat progressivi la issa qeghdin membri shah tal-UE!! Qeghdin fl-UE ghat-tajjeb u ghall-hazin hux!!

Paul Borg

Jan 20th 2010, 16:12

I still think that some kind of censorship has to be kept in place, however I would not proceed with criminal charges against the editor of 'realta'

Whilst the LP is critizising the courts for taking an extreme decision by charging the 'realta' editor it is suggusting a ridiculous extreme measure through which censorship would be removed completely ....Some kind of balance has to be found after all no one would want his/her children to be exposed to something due to the failure of censorship.

K Grech

Jan 20th 2010, 16:04

I can't understand what Labour is trying to get at here.....what is it trying to defend? But why can't labour ever get it right?

Arnold Camilleri

Jan 20th 2010, 16:03

@ Ernest Vella - if by progressive one means that vulgarity and obscenities will carry the day then Labour will remain in the Opposition benches. I dont want to be part of this 'progressive labour'. I'd rather side with the enemy than with friends like these progressives.

Arnold Camilleri

Jan 20th 2010, 16:02

I am sorry but I dont agree with Owen Bonnici. Doesn't he know what obscenity or vulgarity is? Or couldn't care less about our nation's morality. If he doesn't care, WE DO! It was always under Labour governments that Malta's morality went to the dogs. Illegality was the order of the day. We are still bearing the scars of such irresponsibility. We dont need to change anything in our obscenities laws even if these laws are broken left right and centre. Even small children know how to be vulgar thanks to their vulgar and irresponsible parents.

Ernest Vella

Jan 20th 2010, 15:33

PL is gaining momentum on what does Progressive really means...what a disgusting party....defending an article in a newspaper where insulting Mary, the Mother of God is not something obscene, were insulting the sentiments of the Catholic Faith is not obscene,,,but yet these are still hiding there real ideas...but they must remember that no one is higher than God.

I agree with a church - state independent from each other...but here we are speaking of making Malta the prostitue of Europe...no way

Anthony Mizzi

Jan 20th 2010, 15:19

The labour Party is as usual showing all the way forward towards a Malta in the 21st Century

C. Sapiano

Jan 20th 2010, 15:08

The Labour party is as usual dishing out left-wing propoganda. As happened in other countries the left-wing movement is doing its best to destroy the values of a society! Left-wingers try to destroy what is considered good and bad in a society.

Joseph Sammut

Jan 20th 2010, 14:59

Once this committe is set up, wouldn't it be a form of sensorship, which is a hot issue right now: would it be free to perform its duties or would we judge it on weekly TV programs?

Christian Sciberras

Jan 20th 2010, 14:43

What is this? Excusing obscenities? What next, teaching the meaning of "pornography" in primary schools?

P Attard

Jan 20th 2010, 14:17

I repeat what I stated some days ago - I do not wish anybody to be sentenced to prison or fined. However, let not our Members of Parliament forget how internet, films and magazines are flooded with obscenities and vulgarities, if not pornography. They need not open the flood gates to the production and publication of obscenities, vulgarities and obscenities. They must realise the very negative impact of internet and films being shown on our young generation. One obvious result is the enormous number of children being born out of wedlock to single mothers and 'unknown' fathers. Their number is increasing substantially every year and the impact of the current situation has not been felt yet, except, perhaps. on the single mothers and children themselves and on ... social security. Our Members of Parliament and others need not try to impress us with the slogan of freedom of expression when what is produced is neither art nor literature but sheer obscenities and vulgarities if not pornography. The test on our Members of Parliament should be: do they want THEIR OWN CHILDREN to be exposed to vulgarities, obscenities and pornography. Freedom of speech does not equal abuse of speech.

Joseph Aquilina

Jan 20th 2010, 14:15

Don't worry Mark, the laws of Malta are very simple. Break them and then we change them. Or just ignore them and consider them not relevant to the case.