Ex PL secretary warns party against losing its soul

Christian Sciberras

Mar 7th 2010, 03:19

@Dr. A. Alshinawi - Every good scientist knows where theory ends and practice starts.
I for one wouldn't go calling people "theoretically scientists", because if that where the case, just about everyone's a scientist...
Very nice guise of hiding political propaganda behind "modernity, progress, etcetera".
Still, the people at your level (or higher) know the truth, regardless the way you mask it.

Perhaps it's time you review the point of your doctorate.

Dr. A. Alshinawi

Nov 24th 2009, 18:16

@ Christian Sciberras Mr. Sciberras - my thoughts are about politics, progress, modernity and secularism in contemporary times....nothing to do with the exhaustive debate on the PN-MLP dichotomy... Regarding who is called a scientist, you may wish to read, a bit more, I am afraid, about definitions of science, philosophy of science...natural/social sciences...etc.

Christian Sciberras

Nov 24th 2009, 16:29

Dominic Fenech,
A torch is as dead as a glass of water poured upon it.
If you imply that politics are on the same level as metaphores, then by all means, I agree with you.
If not, then it might be the right time you "discover" the point of politics and how they ruin countries.

Dr. A. Alshinawi - First thing, how can you reason that "the best out there is average worst" (when you suggest we all support MLP)?
Secondly, how do you know someone a "scientist" when his subject of choice doesn't have to do with science at all? Does knowing a couple of physics laws make me a magistrate?


The rest; PLEASE quite talking shit.
Politics aren't meant to be dispted incesantly, it's a way to arive to a conclusion.
The Maltese politics never get down to a conclusion, instead they keep going round and round in endless arguments (which are useless anyway).

Muscat. Pat

Nov 24th 2009, 12:24

There is no denying that the PN adopted the labour welfare state model because with the old patria and religio mentality it was going to stay forever in the opposition. Moreover, PN knew that the weak spot for the MLP was " change" and all the contradicition that this brings with it. This strategy was worked out and fine tuned in the greatest detail. The question is, why did the MLP administation, of which Dr Dom Fenech formed part, did nothing about it. The PN knew that the MLP would react in a certain way, if the right bait was exhibited, and alas, the MLP succumbed to these machinations; hence the fracas at Zejtun meetings and at the Times.
In the meantime, the labour welfare state model is being dismantled by the induced unsustainability of the PN; PN sold d assets that sustained the welfare state. This PN welfare state gave birth to 4 billion of euros of debt......which is rising and unsustainable! The welfare state under the PN is becoming the nooze with which to choke off those who really need it. These are the worthwhile debates PL members should engage in.

Anthony Castillo

Nov 23rd 2009, 18:47

What principles you people are talking about as regarding the MLP or PL?. The only principles that the MLP or PL practice since the saviour(salvatur) or traitor (traditur)'I don't know what should I call him because even his believers don't know,onwards the only principles they practise is who's not with us is against us(minn mhux maghna kontra taghna).

Dr. A. Alshinawi

Nov 23rd 2009, 17:07

All progressive minds, regardless of convenient, domestic political association and loyalty, who cherish the role of politics as a progressive, secular force, and seek in Malta a secular state that aims at progress and modernity, should agree with Prof. Fenech. This scientist looks for politics that goes beyond winning elections and becoming Ministers, to bring about change that is progressive, and necessarily, secular, even if the majority, for historical reasons, disagree and resist.

CATherine Desira

Nov 23rd 2009, 16:02

The MLP / PS / PL (whatever one chooses to call it) today is just like the AD - a pressure group and nothing else. 25 years (or almost) in opposition - it simply forgot how to formulate policies/politics. In fact it NEVER EVER offers suggestions, but only criticism. Surely this is NOT how a political party that wants to project itself as a good alternative to the present government should act.

Fenech M D

Nov 23rd 2009, 15:40

Nixtieq nistaqsi lil Profs Fenech jekk tkellimx ma Dr Muscat fuq dawn l-affarijiet biex forsi jitrangaw, qabel ma tkellem fuq it-Times dwarhom, u jekk iva x'rispost kellu.

Jekk qatt ma tkellem ghalija naqas u naqas bil-kbir, ghax kif jghid il-Malti 'Hadd ma jonqox il-paljazza fuq il-bejt'!

J Brincat

Nov 23rd 2009, 14:06

As the son of the famous, by now historilcal, 'Is-Suldati ta' l-AZZAR' who have seen my parents (when I was merely six years old and had had my first Holy communion) really cry in anguish because Archbisop Gonzi had ordered that those who supported Mintoff could not be pardoned when they went to confess because of the imposition of mortal sin, I fully concur with Dr Fenech.

I cannot fanthom why waving of red flags is being discouraged. Also, I cannot understand why the Labour ie PL protest was held in Zabbar and not in traditional Valletta - perhaps a new strategic decision.

In the same way, remembering my parents' suffering for supporting Mnftoff, I can never understand why the same MInftoff voted against his own party in that dreadful 1998 night to the chagrin of his loyal supporters.

Give me the old flag with the traditional torch any time!

Dominic Fenech

Nov 23rd 2009, 13:11

@Albert Farrugia

Labour is a political party, not a regiment, much less a flock of sheep. Show it some respect.

C. Busuttil

Nov 23rd 2009, 02:37

J. Martinelli

Jekk tahseb li l-PN huwa l-istess partit ta' Nerik Mizzi, Gorg Borg Olivier u anke ta' Fenech Adami sejjer hazin, llum l-partit m'huwa xejn hlief kontradizzjoni - b'leadership konservattiva ghax Gonzi u Tonio Borg hekk huma, imma l-votanti Nazzjonalisti l-parti l-kbira taghhom l-anqas biss jaqblu mal-valuri tal-partit jigifiri partit mibni fuq valuri nsara, Dan huma votanti liberali mhux konservattivi. It-trend tal-futur tal-PN ha tkun ta' partit liberali bil-kontra ta' dak li kien fl-istorja glorjuza tieghu. Fuq in-naha l-ohra llum il-labour ihaddan fieh aktar konservattivi milli progressisti, l-aktar nies (ironikament nghid) li ghadhom marbuta mat-taghlim tal-Knisja huma l-laburisti. Fl-amerika jsejjhula realignment tal-politika kif gara bir-repubblikani jispiccaw partit konservattiv u d-democratici partit liberali mentri fl-istorja taghhom sas-snin sittin kienu bil-kontra.

Il-Partit Nazzjonalista kif nafuh s'issa spicca, la darba l-votanti tieghu ma jaqblux u jhaddnu principji differenti minn dawk verament tieghu. Fi zmien ghaxar snin la darba tispicca l-klassi politici tal-prezent naraw partit totalment differenti.

Albert Farrugia

Nov 22nd 2009, 23:10

So it seems that the attempts to discredit yet another Labour leadership have begun in earnest. If Prof Fenech really is Labour at heart, what he should do is to work from within the party, of which he was General Secretary, and not be used as the starting shot for yet another campaing to wear down its leadership. Go on, Prof Fenech, go ahead and do your best to preserve the status quo.

Dominic Fenech

Nov 22nd 2009, 22:21

@Joe Micallef.
The question put to me was not whether we at the MLP knew who were the violent elements. We knew, and believe me, we also knew how much harm they did to the party, but in those days the party administration was in constant competition with the Cabinet ministers -- the most gung-ho of whom were comfortable with rough elements and did not feel in the least answerable to the party.

Other than that, I simply said that neither I nor anybody else knew who the persons were that torched The Times. One assumes they were Labour supporters by inference, as one assumes the terrorists who murdered Karin Grech were PN supporters by inference.

Thanks for the compliment by the way. I'm sure I don't deserve it.

Justin Meli

Nov 22nd 2009, 22:06

nice , at least someone still have some sense in his mind.. all malta seems under some kind of mass opium dependency , everyone is afraid to talk , everyone is motionless , and yes even the pl , which is so wrong .. progressive doesnt mean you twist your beleifs . from the pn i dont expect any better .... and may i ask .. where are the students? is malta producing opiated students that do nothing except moan at their parents for cars and mobile phones? wake up!

C.Sammut

Nov 22nd 2009, 22:02

Dr Mintoff is it perhaps that nowadays there are no longer extreme left or extreme right ideologies and perhaps that means that there is a consensus by the people in general? Or would you prefer a blue and red at each other's throats with opposing manifestos but fighting for the same outcome anyway? Perhaps you can enlighten us as to why you would believe that a fight is healthier than consensus?

Joseph Schembri

Nov 22nd 2009, 21:37

I did not watch the interview but am just commenting on the report above. The torch and so on are reminders to many of us of the uglier times of the labour party. In a perverse sort of way is not the PN losing its soul when it was born as a party for the business classes and conservativism but is now a popular party purportedly fighting for workers' rights?

j micallef

Nov 22nd 2009, 20:46

Prof Fenech has hit the nail on its head. I have been feeling the same way about the PL (i.e. its moving towards the right ) for some time now as I watch and observe closely what is said by PL exponents on radio and TV. One of the most glaring moves that jars so evidently now is the PL's obsession with pandering to businessmen, employers and capitalists in general, even at the cost of seeming to forget the lower working class's struggle to keep up with the rising cost of living. Of course, the PL is doing this to try to woo the money-making class to its bosom in order to increase its chances in the next general election; but in doing so, the PL is losing its soul in my opinion, as the workers and those who can only just manage to keep their head above the poverty line are losing the comfort they used to find in the PL of old. Telling the government to dish out subsidies and to refrain from increasing tariffs for utilities and other services, means just one thing: taxes will have to be raised . Is this what the PL really wants?

G. Mangion

Nov 22nd 2009, 19:51

Ex PL secretary warns party against losing its soul !!!
This is New New's, the mlp never had a SOUL ! AND WILL NEVER HAVE.
Regards.

albert leone ganado

Nov 22nd 2009, 19:41

Unfortunately any organisation or society which loses its fundamental principles and values and the symbols which gives it a historic significance becomes a purely opportunistic animal with no past to nurture it or future to sustain it.
That is why that more than the our temporal and political soul as Nationalists and Labour party adherents we should be more concerned in maintaining our Christian soul and symbols which have truly moulded us as a Maltese people and without which we will sink in the sea which surrounds us.

Mario Bonnici

Nov 22nd 2009, 19:34

@m.portelli
To be fair the problem is not Joseph Muscat but certain MP's and members in the PL that are too conservative.
Joseph more than once spoke in favour of gay rights, divorce and against censorship.

joanne pace

Nov 22nd 2009, 18:29

Dominic u are absolutly right the labour is pandering to the right. But my question is when u were party secretary what did u do to stop violent elements in your party at that time.

Marcel Dingli

Nov 22nd 2009, 17:56

@ E Gatt. At least we would hear someone sing "Sbejha Patrija Uliedek Ahna" . The PN as it is now wanted long ago to remove the badge and the anthem and only didnt do so for conveniance sake. In all truth it is the PN which has lost its soul, more to the left than the Labour Party. Whether Joseph sings Sbejha Patrija or not, as things are at the moment i feel more comfortable voting Labour. Domnic Fenech has a point, he does not want to see what happened to the PN happen to the Labour Party.

m.portelli

Nov 22nd 2009, 17:44

Professor Fenech is spot on. The PL is shying away from an active stand on those issues that should be the prerogative of a true progressive party namely freedom of thought and artistic expression. I also find it disheartingly sad that Labour chose to sideline M.A. Vassalli the father of Maltese secularism similarly to the Education division who apparently can only offer saints as role models for the Maltese. Is M.A. Vassalli such a threat to Labour's election chances?True on the issue of civil rights the PL has made overtures to the gay community however I would be more convinced should it welcome and support an 'openly' gay politician within its ranks next election and actively seek to legislate in favour of freedom of expression and civil rights. The PL is still susceptible to cognitive dissonance, the national past time of the Maltese, but can we at least be clear on the progressive bit?

Joe Micallef

Nov 22nd 2009, 17:28

Prof Fenech,

Insisting that labour could not stop violence because it did'nt know who was behind it can easily be classified as the century's fairy tale. Not only labour knew who they were (and to some assigned a pathetic degree) but they were a fundamental component of the ideology that suffocated labour policies. Moreover if they were not known, then why is Alfred Sant hailed as the leader who distanced himself from them?

It is in the same spirit that you miss the wood for the trees on why the PN has been in government for so long. Tactics are important, but a party is successful in the long term to the measure that it is at the forefront of major strategies, and at least for the last 30 years the PN has always been years ahead of labour - Education, Infrastructure, VAT, IT, Local Councils, EU, Euro and more.

From your interview you come across as wanting change for the purpose of change, independently of what that change implies - that is usually a lab environment not a country.

Despite all, you remain one of the (few) brilliant lecturers I had the privileged to be lectured by!
by

V.Micallef

Nov 22nd 2009, 17:21

Wegibt lil kulhadd, Dom, barra lili. X'passi hadt bhala segretarju tal-MLP kontra dawk il-hamalli li ghamlu daqs dik hsara lill-partit?

Mario Bonnici

Nov 22nd 2009, 17:11

Although I don't agree with all what Dominic Fenech said, I feel that his comments are healthy and needed in this process of change the PL is going through.

Dominic Fenech

Nov 22nd 2009, 16:53

In writing the above, I am not of course applauding J. Martinelli, who never saw anything wrong with the PN, and here takes Marija Falzon to task.

Both lack a vital ingredient.

Dominic Fenech

Nov 22nd 2009, 16:52

Marija Falzon, seems to suggest that the Labour Party should appear to be all things to all people in order to win a popular majority so as to be able to win, and then, once in office, pursue its own party programme. I couldn't disagree more. You can be all things to all people in opposition, but once you're in government you pay the price of contradiction. We have been there before, remember? Secondly, the Labour Party probably already has a majority by default and, if it clarifies where it stands vis-a-vis important issues, is bound to gather a very handsome majority. It is precisely because victory next time is easily within reach that the party should be clear on what it stands for. That includes both socio-economic issues and cultural issues. It will not do, for example, for the party to express sacred wrath over the crucifix issue while remaining silent on rampant censorship, just so as to maximize votes. (It will not maximize votes that way anyway, because young people especially abhor the kind of paternalism advocated by Marija Falzon).

L GRECH

Nov 22nd 2009, 16:26

Mr Fenech is right

e,g. Pl remained silent when recently we had the chief of NATO holing talks with the prime minister and the people have the right to know what was discussed! The opposition has the duty to guard over the constitution otherwise it is illegitimate!

Malcolm Briffa

Nov 22nd 2009, 16:08

Domnic Fenech lost a lot of credibility with this single interview. A Political Party should not be afraid to take calculated risks in a society which is characterised by its permeability of change.
Dr. Muscat is doing a lot of good inside his party. As he himself stated, change within the party will happer... an earthquake is needed, one that will hurt a few who are unaccustomed to change (like Domnic) but which ultimately is in the best interest of the PL and the country.

Dominic Chircop

Nov 22nd 2009, 16:07

V. Micallef, you are obviously missing the point.

When has wishing for a liberal-minded party started as being understood as being for one side or another ? What have past violent incidents got anything to do with wishing for a secular state ?

No wonder people are leavimg both parties, and the Church, in their thousands. Unlike V. Micallef, most have a mind of their own. Or does he still believe that certain politiciansare "uomini mandati da Dio"?

V.Micallef

Nov 22nd 2009, 14:41

Hallina, Dom. Issa trid titkellem? Ghax ma tkellimtx meta l-hamalli ghamlu daqs dik hsara lill-Partit?

J Martinelli

Nov 22nd 2009, 14:02

@ marija falzon et al

The public would love to hear what the LP's principles are/were!

Integration or Independence?
EU membership or EU Partnership?
Partnership or 'Now EU membership is OK?
Devalue the Lira or join the Eurozone?
Green environment or oppose Sant'Antnin?
Continue massive subsidies or 'User pays'?
Reduce taxes or lower deficit?
Status quo or progress?
Truth or spins?

What principles? Where? When?

c.camilleri

Nov 22nd 2009, 13:46

A political party that does not change with the sign of times, is a dead party.

Example.

PN changed to Gonzi PN

MLP changed to PL

Labour accepted the EU.

PN accepted every ( all ) social benefit they voted against.

MLP is using the PN slogan is-sewwa jirbah zgur.

PN is using the MLP slogan Malta l-ewwel u qabel kollox.

And the list goes on......................

M. Magro

Nov 22nd 2009, 13:06

I agree with most of Professor Fenech's arguments, except the one regarding crucifixes; the difference between the censorship of a play, and the 'censorship' of crucifixes in state schools, is that the attending the performance of the play is voluntary, whilst sending your kids to school is obligatory.

John Abela

Nov 22nd 2009, 13:00

E Gatt
well since the nationalist have lost their ideology...being the maltese nationals come first...I guess there was ample space for PL to butt in and replace them.

E Gatt

Nov 22nd 2009, 12:50

I am a Nationalist but I understand Dr Fenech’s arguments.

Recently the Labour Party are trying too hard to copy PN. On one hand this is quite flattering, on the other hand they are coming across as being fake: Plastic Labour.

Changing the name, moving away from red, waving the EU flag, wearing a blue tie, ending a speech in ‘ is-sewwa jirbah zgur’, expressing disappointment that income tax rates have not yet come down . What’s next? Will we soon hear Dr Muscat singing “Sbejha Patrija uliedek ahna” ? ;)

Mario Bonnici

Nov 22nd 2009, 12:41

@Dominic Chircop
In a way I agree with you. Take the divorce issue for example. There are a lot of Labour MP's that already expressed themselves against.
Is this this the new Progressive Movement??!!

marija falzon

Nov 22nd 2009, 12:34

You cannot live simply by nostalgia. The PL is not a flag waving pressure group. It is being led by principles, by a vision to make our country better. To do this it has to win elections. Yes, militancy is an important function of any political party. But it is not the sole live by rule. The party has to appeal to the vastest majority of the population. In today's scenario, we all know too well that by putting militancy at the forefront, there is no chance this majority will be achieved, as has been well proven for the past 25 years.

Dominic Chircop

Nov 22nd 2009, 12:10

Bully to you, Dr. Fenech.

The present PL has become as conservative as the PN. In fact, a few of its MP's are modern day Savonarolas, and one gets the impression they are in the wrong party. The PL is deluding itself when it says it is a progressive coalition. Any liberal thought is not encouraged, and the sacrifices of Labourutes in the late 50's and early 60's have been all in vain.

I remember Labourites then singing, to the tune of "Yellow Submarine" .......
" we all live taht il-gvern tal-qassisin".

Fifty years later it is even worse. We are still living under that type of government, but, unfortunately, even the Oppisition is becoming a Papist party.

frank grech

Nov 22nd 2009, 11:02

Dear Mr. Fenech
Maybe that is why the Labour Party lost so many general elections. To keep your head immersed in the past is sheer suicide, the writing has been on the wall for a very long time.
People like you can only harm the labour Party. Wake up and smell the coffee!!!!!

dusty williams

Nov 22nd 2009, 10:53

Ghallanqas naghmlu hekk b'mod nadif u trasparenti, naghmlu hekk ghax iz-zminijiet jinbidlu, naghmlu hekk ghax nemmnu li n-nies jisthoqqilhom ahjar.

Hekk mhux kollox se taqbel mieghu, pero billi jkun hemm xi tibdil, ma jfissirx li t-twemmin xellugi ma jibqax go fina. Li nkunu moderati ma jfisser xejn hazin. Skond