MLP delegates reject extension of voting rights

Oscar Cassar

May 20th 2008, 14:24

Is that Pawlu Sammut (involved in the election on A.Sant as leaner in 1993) in your photo?

P.J. Mifsud

May 14th 2008, 16:32

@David Gatt

It's not solely PN supporters who are dismayed with the MLP delegates decision rejecting extension of voting rights to choose the new leader but all level headed voters who have no party affiliation and all bona fide labourites. This is a clear indication that the ruling MLP inside clique in control of Labour now have a free hand to manipulate the forthcoming election to suit their wishes. The delegates have shot down George Abela's proposal even though around 150 of them signed Ms Pullicino's motion to amend the party statute. Evidently the inside clique finds it easier to manipulate the vote of 900 hand picked, mostly yes-men delegates than the broad, hard-to-influence views of 20,000 Party members.

Do rest assured that now the MLP is going to have the candidate favoured by the clique. However, I wouldn't be so dead certain about asserting that the new leader will bring Gonzi down in the next general election. Remember, this time you were 100% sure that Labour would be winning by a 15,000 majority and yet you missed the boat by a mere 1,500 votes!!
Please take A. Muscat's advice about this issue. This is a contest between those who are so used to losing and find themselves so comfortable being in opposition (they would rather stay there than suffer the extreme stress of running the country) that they are prepared to continue giving walk-overs to the PN and those real labourites who really want to change and reform the Party to attain success.

Malcolm Seychell

May 12th 2008, 23:41

@ Ralph Cassar.

I think you are being ridiculous about what you are saying about PN.

I was an AN candidate and I must say that the PN strategy for the election was perfect.

To win 3 elections in a row is no joke and surely it demands a lot of hard work and organisation.

For your info as well Joe Saliba stated on Xarabank that he is not against the tessarati of PN should vote in future for top position.

For the moment PN are fine as they are. I can assure you that they are already working for next election

Changes need to be done urgently in MLP and also your party who didn't increase much its vote margin in 18 years.

About Azzjoni Nazzjonali I can tell that changes will happen very shortly.

Albert Gauci Cunningham

May 12th 2008, 20:16

Not at all Ralph Cassar...it is a fact that the PN won 6 of the last 7 elections and therefore something somewhere was done correctly....while the MLP lost one election after the other so something somewhere must have been done wrong!!! Thats no euphoria thats the truth!! I also think that the "logitics" excuse is just that ; an excuse!! The MLP after all is a very powerful political force which like the PN knows who is Nationalist or not practically on a door to door basis!! So saying that many tesserati are Pn supporters is just an excuse!!

Before you sleep Mr.Ralph Cassar can you please tell us of the AD's soul searching excercise! I'm sure one of your proud supporters on this blog ( or so she claims) will be willing to give you a piece of her mind and help you with 'igloo' metaphors!! Sweet Dreams!

Joe Martinelli

May 12th 2008, 20:11

Joe Galea, et al - your main argument seems to be that the NP has more or less trhe same voting procedures as the MLP.
What has that to do with rejecting a motion to allow tesserati to vote for the new leader of the MLP? Why is the MLP always following? Can it not lead for a change? Besides a similar motion has never been presented by any NP delegate, contestant or even a card carrying member, so your argument does not apply.
What you are afraid of is the possibility of someone other than the 'intended' one being elected and who can possibly rock the boat within the party.
The old establishment's thinking is 'we have done it this way for many years so there is no need for a change now'. It is a status quo party with no desire to change. Other excuses we heard were - 27 days are not enough to organize the membership-wide vote - new membership block enrollment could take place.
27 days were more than enough to put a ballot box at every Labour Party club where members could have voted. The fear of an all out recruitment of new members could easily have been controlled by a simple addition to the motion that only registered and verified members would be able to vote and who had joined the party prior to the passing of the motion. Thereafter a member has to be in good standing (paid up) at least six months prior to any vote. Simple isn't it? That is assuming that the party administration has up to date membership lists.
What was missing in the general meeting was not the capacity to accommodate the members. What was missing was the will to change and for some to put their job on the line.

JOHN SCERRI

May 12th 2008, 19:24

A decision has now been taken . I shall not discuss what already has been decided upon .

The next step forward in order to render such an important choice for MLP and for our country's future is for the election to be felt as being just, fair and that all contestants are on a level playing field.
MLP paid up members as well as the public in general would want to see as well as feel this happening.

My questions are these:
1: Assuming none of the contestants gets 50% +1 vote what will be the next step?
Can someone who is familiar with the statute regulations kindly explain for information purposes please?

Shall there be another election ?
or
Will the ballot paper be in the form of a single transferrable vote system where in the event as stated in Question 1 above occurs, such contestants obtaining least number of first preference votes will be eliminated hence their votes will be tranferred according to second and third preferences in order for every valid vote cast to have its value in the election?

A Muscat

May 12th 2008, 17:38

@Miguel Fenech
I have not said that last Friday's was an undemocratic event. Why do you argue with what I have not said?

I said that important decisions like electing a leader merit direct democracy once every five years which is better than representative democracy. it does not mean that representative democracy is undemocratic but as labour does not command a good record of their representatives electing winning leaders it would have been proper to give a chance to direct democracy at least in this crucial issue.

If you are happy with Labour's serial record of election losses than you don't need to change anything. Enjoy winning local elections and MEP elections!!

Miguel Fenech

May 12th 2008, 15:45

@ A Muscat - I regret to say that the argument you presented is not convincing me that last Friday an undemocratic event occurred in MLP. I agree with you that people vote every 5yrs for representatives, and this is Democracy. In fact, the story doesn't stop there. During those 5yrs the people do not vote again (except for extraordinary referenda) and every decision is taken by their representatives. In the case of MLP, the tesserati choose themselves who the 900 delegates are on a local level. If you look at the benefits of being an MLP tesserat you will notice that you will have the right to vote to choose delegati in your locality, or even become a delegate yourself. Therefore, I reiterate that just as MPs represent people who chose them, delegati represent tesserati who chose them. Where is the lack of democracy?? On the contrary, I think it's more democratic than with MPs since MPs have much more power than MLP delegati and much less time to talk to people in the streets. Oh an by the way, not even the members of Cabinet reflect what the people's vote said! Which process showed the most Democracy?

Joe Galea

May 12th 2008, 13:41

I am just a "tesserat" and not a delegate. Well done to the delegates. If the motion would have passed we would have seen a lot of new tesserati cropping up from everywhere. MLP went through a democratic voting system and for those who didn't swallow this decision it's their problem. But please stop insulting MLP and Labourites of being undemocratic and similar crap. PN have the same voting system or worse. Even the title of this article is wrong as it "as usual" spits venom against MLP. When are we going to mature in this country? And you expect Labour to accept pairing adn the speaker offer. Come on!!!!

silvan said

May 12th 2008, 13:25

I have one simple question for all the MLP supporters here who seem vindicated that the MLP delegates rejected the extension of voing rights. How can you accept a statement from your party's administration that having an election with 27,000 voters would be "logistically impossible".

They are simply proving to you their incompetence, their inadequate organisational skills, their love for status quo (as long as they are part of it) and their fear of the unknown.

In short the stuff that loses elections! Wake up or dream on.

R Cassar

May 12th 2008, 10:54

What a funny debate... PN 'tesserati' do not choose the PN leaders, only PN delegates do that (they call them 'kunsilliera')...PN 'kunsilliera' do not even choose the Party secretary general... he is anointed by the executive council ... the MLP do the same for leader etc. (different for secretary general who is elected by the delegates... so there is not much difference is there? and enlightened people like Albert GC cannot even debate the issues but continue in their euphoric rants about how great and glorious the PN is! yawn yawn yawn!!

A Muscat

May 12th 2008, 10:40

@Miguel Fenech
You are confusing things. Once every five years the electorate individually chooses our representatives by voting in a general elections. Than the elected candidates represent us in parliament for 5 years. So what is wrong if once every 5 years the party membership vote for their leader who will then represent them for the next five years. That is democracy!

Don't tell me that the PN don't do it. The PN are no benchmark and after all the PN don't need to change as they are winning. When you lose three consecutive elections than you need to change and the choice of the leader is the single most important factor that influences the result of the next election. Delegates have been getting it wrong for far too long. If Labour get it wrong four times in a row they can just as well turn CNL into a supermarket as Toni Abela seems to suggest.

@David Gatt
When are Labourites going to learn to do what's right without bothering what the PN thinks. They have been pulling our strings for far too long. They have literally been choosing our leaders for us. Why have the PN been finding it so easy to know all that happens behind closed doors within Labour?

@all the rest

This is not a contest between Abela and Muscat. It is not a contest between tesserati and delegati. It is a contest between those who are so used to losing and so comfortable in opposition that they are prepared to continue giving walkovers to the PN and those who really want change to bring success. Its a choice between the status quo and the spirit of 92/96.

Mary Vella

May 12th 2008, 09:25

Dear AGC, I did not answer your questions because you did not ask any :) You seem to have a difficulty to distinguish between a statement and a question. No problem. Reception class will remedy this state of affairs :) What do you want me to do, dear; react to your statement ' winning an election is the raison d'etre of any political party' ? Well, I am sure that the likes of Robert Mugabe would perfectly agree with your statement...or to implication that I consider that : ...we Maltese are imbecilli for voting into power the NP again? No I do not think those who voted Nationalists neither imbecilli nor kabocci. They may include pragmatics who are very pleased at the way Mepa operates, overjoyed at some promotion or some new job they may have rightly been allocated, foreign contract workers who fear that their contract may not be renewed etc. Similarly I do not consider those who vote Mugabe kabocci for having been allocated plots of land etc. Now go get a sense of humor. The Berlin wall has fallen and you have no obligation to repeat what 'the oracle' states but you have the freedom to think. You are intelligent enough to be a credit to Malta. Do not waste your potential. Ciao and take care

Miguel Fenech

May 12th 2008, 07:53

MPs are chosen by the people to represent the people. Likewise, Delegates in MLP are chosen by the "tesserati" and they represent the "tesserati". This represents the actual definition for "democracy" and not the contrary. In Democracy, people represent people, and not everyone votes. For all those who think that this was yet another defeat for Democracy in MLP I would just like them to imagine how it would be if all Maltese voters would be asked to vote each time a new law is proposed in Parliament, instead of trusting the MPs. At least the delegates do represent the "tesserati" and they voted on their behalf as well. On whose behalf, for instance, did PN choose to enter the PfP? Was there a discussion at least in Parliament? Funny how some people criticise MLP all the time but still shout "Partit Glorjuz Nazzjonalista". Very intelligent indeed.

David Gatt

May 12th 2008, 03:36

It's clear that PN supporters were not happy with this decision, and that does mean something. I would really worry to see PN helping MLP, cause we know what kind of help the PN can give t the MLP.

Labour will have the leader that will take Gonzi down next election. That's a promise.

Albert Gauci Cunningham

May 11th 2008, 22:37

..........Did Maria Vella answer one of my questions?? Noooo..she continues to dig deeper and deeper in personal attacks and jibes!!! Prosit Maria I'm sure you make Harry, freddy and the very, very intelligent class of people ,who are not PN, very proud!!!!!!! My logic is quite simple : the PN (warts and all) won elections the MLP did not!!!!! While at it why don't you tell Harry to publicly repeat what you are saying i.e----the MLP/AD form a majority and therefore the PN govt. is illegitamate!!!!.....Of course he won't say it!! Thats MLP material darling which makes you either a labourite or a ""Green"" ( which means a quasi- Labourite too!!!!!!!)

Anger??-------yeah I'm soooooo angry..........all these electoral victories make me soooooooo angry!!!!!!!!......................I have no interest in answering Ms.Maria Vella back since its very clear that she's only interested in throwing vitriolic attacks on "imbecilli" like me and impress me with her knowledge of English!!!!!!................Long live MLP, AD and the intelligent, democratic, enlightened and "bravi" bunch who hate the PN with a passion!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Pity you're always stuck in Opposition!!!!!!

martin portelli

May 11th 2008, 21:55

@ Vincent Cauchi
I see that you have not yet discovered the merits of humour. What is comparable is the attempt to hinder the right to voice a different opinion. I am assuming that you put yourself above reproach because you did not indulge in any negative behaviour with regards someone’s right to voice a different opinion. If this is indeed the case than you earn my respect. Would you however state that Mr. Mifsud was not booed? After your take on events you argued that delegates merited the disparaging reactions because their arguments were weak and banal. Do be careful you are legitimising such future behaviour from which ever side of the divide it comes! How can you justify that? Would you say Dr. Zrinzo Azzopardi’s commendable interventions regarding comments and heckling from the audience were directed at a different crowd to that gathered at CNL? I am sure you could enlighten those that voted you in as delegate at least on whether you actually condone the behaviour? You do have a duty to show them the way out of the fly bottle. (or maybe you can hold a session at your local club, screen a recording of that conference and let them decide for themselves). I have no intention of tarring the whole lot of delegates, I am simply commenting on observable behaviour. Any self respecting journalist will confirm Roland Barthes’ truism that ‘what is noticed is definitely notable’

saviour cachia

May 11th 2008, 21:45

@Vincent Cauchi
First of all, I better warn you not to let me hang dirty linen outside. There is quite a long story about people ' who use their vote as a threat' and if you know the whole story, as you seem to know, please remember it would do the party no good to take skeletons out of the wardrobe.
So, yes, the delegates, democratically, kept the right ( I better not say privilege, because it irks lot of persons within the Red Glass Palace) to elect the leader of the Malta Labour Party. They did not feel it wise to share it with paid up members.
Hope that their chose will be an intelligent one and the leader chosen will be a winner. No matter the effort you are doing to beat around the bush, Mr. Cauchi, it is evident that the MLP is in a mess... seemingly not knowing exactly the number of paid of members,seemngly not knowing who of these paid of members has dual membership with the PN, and find it so hard to organise a simple way for the so called 19,000 paid up members vote for the new leader. What would have been wrong, if the MLP would have been the first or along a few parties in the world, who adopt such a system?
Come on, be accountable, publish the whole list of members and to what year they have paid their subscription up to now. Or is refuge being sought in the Data Protection Act!!???
If in the past, when Dr. George Abela was elected Deputy Leader by the delegates, the system was yielding results, certainly there was no need for a change.
By today through faults, which I leave to Mr. Cauchi's imagination, the Malta Labour Party has lost three consecutive general elections.
So is it right that 'Honorable and privileged delegates Michael Cohen, Paul Farrugia, and former colleague Aleander Balzan' spoke so vehemently against giving us, paid up members, a chance to choose the leader and reform the system of electing the party leader?Okay we might be only members, who according to the statute so far, are called upon to choose delegates to represent us in the general or extraordinary general conferences of the MLP.
But, I remind Mr. Cauchi, that there is a quite a notable difference. At least, we are updated in our membership fee, not like a powered official who unfortunately was given a high post in the administration, when it was alleged, he was some years back in payment of the party's subscription at the time of being elected by our dear delegates.
Maybe, this is not a classical example of the mess the MLP is in today? Perhaps such an allegation, which as far as i can remember was never denied, does not amount to a load of hogwash and insults the intelligence and integrity of 900 persons delegated to elect the party's administration?
Mr. Cauchi for the sake of the party, you better shut up. Ok, the delegates elected to ignore a great chance for the party to make a step forward towards a wider say in the election of the leader of the MLP.
It was their privilege to do so. Now I only hope for a decision taken freely, not subject to influence as in yonder years, and in the best interest of the party.

Maria Vella

May 11th 2008, 19:12

Dear AGC,

Please do not for one moment think that I want you to stop giving your opinion ... I find your contributions to be mirthfully obtuse. Please carry on with your quixotic gallops on windmills never mentioned. So sweet. I specifically find your perception that I am some kind of labour flag-waving aficionada, and no less a JM aficionada particularly amusing.

Ironic too. Because I did in fact support Alternattiva's environment agenda. Now that brings to mind the fact that Alternattiva/labour won the majority of votes. Yet we still have a boring NP 'tal-kuntratturi' governing with a relative majority when the absolute MLPAD majority is unable to translate that into parliamentary majority. Wow And the NP sees a massive 2.5% decline in its popular vote…and the Kap is to-day confirmed through a hand-waiving exercise…and I defend your right to tell all how the labour party should elect its leader. Please make sure that you keep your logic coming over. I for one find it to be prime entertainment indeed.

Re: anger, I suggest you re-read what you write. You may perhaps want to calm down, young man, even if you continue to hibernate in your metaphorical igloo.

Albert Gauci Cunningham

May 11th 2008, 18:03

Implying that the PN is as democratic as Robert Mugabe just goes to show the depths people like Maria Vella are ready to go down to.................I do not dwell with personal insults and poilitical imbecelities like Maria Vella who's just one step away from telling everyone and his brother that we Maltese are imbecilli and "kabocci" for voting the PN in power again!!
I reiterate my claims that its useless to compare the PN with the MLP because the former won 6 elections out of 7 ( and YES WINNING AN ELECTION IS THE RAISON D'ETRE OF A POLITICAL PARTY ms.Vella!!!!) and I find the excuse of logistical problems as insulting towards Labourites themselves!!! If the MLP is full of tesserati nazzjonalisti then no wonder you open il-Mument and find out all the ongoings of the MLP!!!!!!!
Ms.Maria Vella might still be very bitter towards the PN but she has to understand that the people are sovereign and their say is the last one and they chose ( yes with a much lesser extent and with an amount of cautiosness!!) the PN and in the same breath told the MLP something like this".....you've been in Opposition for 20 yrs....you've done nothing apart from moan, you have no viable alternatives, you have a Leader who we wouldn't trust in a zillion years and you have many supporters like Ms.Maria Vella who think they have a divine right to bash and indirectly call anyone she likes an imbecile just because her "glorious" Party lost"

................as a young voter I'd like to see a better MLP, thats why I've repeatedly said that Evarist Bartolo is the right candidate but ppl like Ms.Vella are so "poisoned" by the "Muscat Braaaaavu Brigade" that ppl like Mr.Bartolo don't even stand a bloody chance!! Well done Maria ....go on Maria!! make Labour better for the Laburist and live in the eternal hope of earning a prize you haven't deserved for so long!!!! People like me will not stop giving our opinion because someone like Ms.(nobody) Vella thinks I'm an "imbecilli" ....I' dont give a rats' about ppl who think they own their party....people who infest both the MLP and the PN!!!!!!!!!

Vincent Cauchi

May 11th 2008, 15:48

@Martin Portelli
How can you compare the organized heckling of Alfred Sant by the student rabble at University with a few murmurs and sounds of discontent at Labour’s Extraordinary General Conference last Friday? Sant was booed and hissed even when he spoke about the problem of breast screening and there was absolutely no heckling in Hamrun last Friday.
No, Joseph Muscat does not come into the equation by default. He was, and so far remains, the only contender to be mentioned by name and brought into the fray by Dr George Abela since the campaign began. In his interview with the Sunday Times of April 13, Dr Abela said that it appeared that Joseph Muscat is already being given a helping hand to be the next anointed leader and went on to say that: "Maybe people believe that the 'internal contest' can be easily won with Joseph as the leader... they are interpreting a vote for Joseph as a vote to retain the status quo." Did any other candidate go this far or mention any name? The answer is a resounding no and, judging by George Abela’s statement, Joseph Muscat is not in the discussion by default but by design.
If the campaign has since degenerated into a race between two candidates to the detriment of all other candidates, the strategy behind all this lies at the door of who started it all in the first place by continuously playing the victim of an infernal party machine working against him. This was definitely not Joseph Muscat. The debate is further degenerated by allegations such as yours when you wrote that that Joseph Muscat’s “stalwarts” heaped insults on the speakers for the motion you had posted in your first comment and you did not have the decency to retract.

@ Saviour Cachia
Now that Mr Cachia’s battle for a wider Leadership electorate has been democratically soundly beaten it seems that he is embarking on another crusade, this time against the messengers and not against the message. He is accusing the delegates that they will eventually be electing a candidate the suits Jason Micallef. What a load of hogwash and what an insult to the intelligence and integrity of 900 people! Mr Cachia has now taken to call delegates “priviledged” with abandoned sarcasm forgetting the persons who elected George Abela as Deputy Leader for Party Affairs years back where no more and no less “priviledged” than the ones who voted against his inspired motion last Friday. In the same sarcastic vain he thanks “Honorable and privileged delegates Michael Cohen , Paul Farrugia and former colleague Aleander Balzan, for proving the mess the MLP is in”. Mr Cachia, Labour is not in a mess. Labour is passing through a period of catharsis that will see it come out stronger once the leadership issue is settled and everyone begins to work in a team to create a renewed electable party.

It is people with chips on their shoulders, who use their vote as a threat who put Labour in a mess

Maria Vella

May 11th 2008, 14:18

Dear AGC, I just took a look at the standards applied here and have stayed faithful to the maxim ' when in rome do as the romans do'. Quite enjoyable I must say having a dig at insularity squirming in its collective middling igloos. You call me partonising. Well, it’s the order of the day no, with so many Nats telling Labour what is noxious best for labour with a straight face. When you wake up to Malta’s realities perhaps you can start seeking, in the meantime I enjoy my comfortable seat watching do-gooders on their pseudo-high moral ground passing judgment on the other lot with the abandon of charlatan morons. I do not know why, but when one talks of victories as a benchmark, I seem to recall a certain Robert Mugabe who has enjoyed victory after victory these last few decades. So what am I supposed to do? Faint at the marvelous flair of the man?

Sean Scicluna

May 11th 2008, 12:02

RE: Noel Barry...

'EFA bringing peace to this country!'

dear me, you must either be a teenager or else you must have been reading twice a day that trash of 'Liberta' Mhedda' everyday of your miserable life... We may have got rid of Sant, but it's the end in sight for EFA too hopefully in a years' time. Can't wait! Then, only then we can really start looking forward for a new way of doing poltics in this country..!

Francis Piscopo

May 11th 2008, 11:12

What's all the fuss about? The MLP should just abandon ship and give in to what the Paladins of Democracy desire:

One Government, One Party, One Prime Minister

Malta deserves no more. Malta needs no more.

Ryan Azzopardi

May 11th 2008, 09:28

aren`t we living in a democracy? so what`t wrong if only the delegates choose the next leader. They will be doing so according to the statue of the party, thus, they are doing no irregularities or wrong doings!

This was an attempt pushed forward by george abela to accomodate him, and just himself, in this leadership race. `il-buzzieqa nfaqghet f`wiccu`

martin portelli

May 11th 2008, 08:57

@ Vincent Cauchi
Oh come on where’s the harm in stretching your face into a smile every now and then , surely you don’t need my advice on that . However if certain arguments were weak and banal you would politely control yourself or else put a patronising smile on your face as the pseudo malign , illogical and downright stupid drone on. Do you mean to say the behaviour of University students last election campaign was excusable on the grounds that the arguments they were jeering at were weak and banal? I was there that particular occasion and did not find that speaker’ arguments weak or banal and had I found them so would not have done so. I had in fact thought back then, that was how nationalists acculture their children to refute arguments. I thought that the right to freely express one’s self was a given. I have no desire to identify any one re sighing oohing and aaahing. That’s on their democratic conscience.
It is not a question of whether I brought Joseph Muscat into the equation, I think he was there by default. This campaign has degenerated into an either or to the detriment of all the other candidates. It doesn’t take a Machiavelli to surmise the strategy. And I assume by prejudice you mean the temerity to voice an opinion ?

@G. Sammut
re (1) The arrogance of your argument is nothing more than an unfortunate case of sour grapes.etc

I assume you still face the wall in Plato’s cave mesmerized by the play of shadows. My argument was not against the democratic process it was against hindering the right to speak.
(2) Stating that this was somehow orchestrated by Joseph Muscat or anyone else is evidence of the poorness of your logic etc...
The entertainment doesn’t stop. ! la man of course I don’t credit Joseph Muscat with the orchestration I expect that particular side of things resides with someone else.

Re the Labour Party itself which was forced into a lose-lose situation
My heart bleeds redder than yours believe me , keep insisting on scape goating the bete noir is it so difficult to face the sun ?

RE (3) The easy lash of your accusations and your reactions at yesterday's defeat are the sole reason why Labour has been forced into opposition since 1998.

Gosh man you credit me with Labour’s defeats since 1998? I never was part of that strategy team or the others that followed either.

RE It is people like you who are the greatest bane of this beloved worker's party.

Really? Because the party machine takes our loyalty for granted? Why because we keep voting Labour no matter how much our intelligence is insulted? Please don’t patronise those of us who passionately choose to vote Labour. Thank you very much .

(4) Had you listened to the arguments being put forth ........ electable transformation in to European Social Democratic Party

I am assuming you’re a delegate and other than being rather good at recognising hollow arguments you now have a crusading mission to make MLP electable
( and this really takes the biscuit) turn it into the European Social Democratic party. You speak as if those same delegates were somehow absent from the scene these past 10 years of limbo What have you been doing these past 10 years may I ask . Were you too afraid to voice a democratic opinion , you clearly had a chance to do that during the debates for the referendum and the 2003 elections. Heqq you missed an excellent opportunity to give birth to European Social Democratic Malta Labour party 10 years earlier ( nb I do hope you won’t be tabling a motion for an amendment to change the party name ) I wonder if you have fully grasped the consequences of that non action yet.

Re the inclusive hand that will extend my way

I would like to see Labour in government much more than you would .I do not carry the burden of being a delegate who could have done something but chose not to these past 10 years. I chose, uncouth and puny member that I am to abide by the rules and vote for delegates to represent me, to engineer change if needed and to challenge what needs or needed challenging. I placed my trust in those with bigger brains/brawn than lowly me. What I can’t fathom is this idea that somehow no one can be held accountable for bad choices, when the consequences of 3 electoral defeats are primarily suffered by loyal labourites who probably never set foot in MLP headquarters.
Re the hand that will extend my way and others like me I only have your word for it till now. I‘ll keep it in good faith like I’ll be keeping my Labour beliefs and values.

Wistin Schembri

May 11th 2008, 08:53

@ CR Taliana

I think that your comments go to the heart of the matter. The delegates' choice will probably not reflect the rank and file's choice.

It is evident (see certain surveys eg Malta Today and Alfred Mifsud's website) that the delegates are not representative of the people 'out there'. This is understandable as the outgoing leadership (its higheset echelons) managed to sideline and silence those who weren't in line with el capo in the most perfect and absolute manner. The most glaring manifestation is the party's media.

The annoited is there for all (sorry, the delegates) to see and vote for. Just do it........

C.R.Taliana

May 11th 2008, 07:30

What is the delegates' role? To represent the members. Now I think it would have been interesting to conduct a survey among the paid members and see what their view was about this issue. I believe that if the delegates really knew what people are saying outside the local comittees then the vote outcome would have been different. Since the delegates are the representatives of all the paid members then their vote should reflect the paid members will.

effie carbonaro

May 11th 2008, 02:35

mr.berry your ways are shameful and full of lies.what the nats did to borg oliver is shameful and was anti democratic and the same was done to dalli on his run to become leader of the pn.in these last 25 years the nats promised us a better future but in his last speech gonzi talked about a black cloud coming Malta's way.how much speeches differ from before an election and after but thats the pn winning ways mr berry

Michael Tabone

May 11th 2008, 00:24

I have to agree with Mr. Patrick Vella on his last comment, and many feel the same way about this PN and MLP supporters alike. A lot of the MLP delegates are happy where they are and enjoy their positions. They don't want to loose them because a stronger leader may come to power. The rumour and word going around is many of the delegates want Joseph Muscat as the new leader of the opposition, while George Abela has more support from the MLP members.

Easy to see why the delegates would wish to have Joseph Muscat. A young and in-experienced leader would be the perfect candidate so that most delicates remain in their positions. Easy to manipulate and so on. They say he has the experience from representing Malta in the the EU Parliament. Thats nothing compared with the responsibility of running a country.

From what I've been able to understand, it's not what the supporters want, it's about what the delicates believe is their safest option for the benefit of their own interests. History just seems to repeat itself doesn't it.

saviour cachia

May 10th 2008, 22:27

@vincent cauchi
Thanks Mr. Cauchi, I just put it straight to you: I do not need any lessons in democracy. I lived the sixties and the eighties and so know what democracy and freedom of expression means. let me inform you that I know Michael Cohen, Paul Farrugia and Aleander Balzan personally. They had every right, yes, to express themselves, perhaps not the way that did, but when you analyze their speech you realize that the three of them slipped badly.
It did no honour to the Malta Labour Party which since being founded was that progressive to be always one step ahead of the Nationalist Party, even in organisational skills. To hear the referred to speakers opposing such a motion to give a say to the paid up members because of logistics problems, not enough time, the petition was forwarded when the race had already began, former labourites not welcomed come back again in the MLP folds, add up to the insult of losing a general election when according to the surveys held tightly to the breast of the privileged few at the CNL, the MLP was 4%ahead or rather had an estimated advantage of 10,000 votes over the PN and moving to a runaway victory.
These are the leaders and administration that in the last three elections were elected solely by the privileged delegates, the untouchables according to Paul Farrugia (ix-Xitan), whose behaviour left much to be desired.
Once again the delegates preferred to keep the ball in their feet. They seem to have been much influenced by the Party machine or the inner core who does not fancy a return of Dr. George Abela at the MLP headquarters.
Hope the delegates will do the right chose and elect a winner. Because for a fourth consecutive defeat in the general elections in 2013 will be much too much and by then the only way for the MLP will not be up, but out.

John Dingli

May 10th 2008, 22:07

Suits us (Nazzjonalisti) fine. After 10 years (in their comfy opposition seats) at their disposition with nothing much else to do but prepare a winning strategy they did nada, zilch, and now seem to want to revert to their same old party in their same old ways. Fine. I look forward to MLP sitting in opposition seats for and years years to come yet.

Francis Attard

May 10th 2008, 21:35

The number of people who elect party leaders is immaterial. It's the number of voters who choose them as Prime Ministers that counts.

Albert gauci Cunningham

May 10th 2008, 21:09

PN VS. MLP----why on earth is it that on this blessed island when "our Party does something that is considered wrong we look at the other Party and take comfort in saying "....heqq anke huma hux...". The PN with its present system won 1981, 1987, 1992, 2004 ( election and referendum) under Eddie Fenech Adami and 2008 under Dr.Gonzi!! So it is pathetic that some bloggers here keep looking at the PN...the PN won the electoral tests the MLP did not!!
LOGISTICS PROBS.???----It would be funny had it not been so sad!! So these Labour supporters want us to believe that the MLP which represents nearly half this island does not have the right resources to ask 19,000 of its members to vote??...and what's this about tesserati being PN activists?? So you're saying that a sizeable amount of paying members are actually Nationalist?? If this is so than the MLP is in a dire crisis!!
....................by the way reading through some of these blogs one starts wondering; are these the same ppl who felt sooo hurt by what they said were personal attacks on Dr.Sant?? We've been called "PN lickers" by at least 2 ppl here.....but I suppose its OK to be personal if you're an MLP supporter!!!!!!!!

The paladins of Change and Bidu Gdid had an opportunity to start change and instead they chose the Status Quo and no amount of shortcomings on the PNs side can erase the fact that the MLP remains a Party lead by a clique of people who want to safeguard their interests!!!

Maria Vella your comments are so digustingly patronising and downright offensive!! Dont worry I pitied people like you quite a lot when you went hooting your horns and singing on the 9th of march celebrating an MLP victory only to be dwarfed back home and accept the poisoned chalice of defeat....and yesterday the delegates gave these same ppl the authority to do as they please with the MLP!! Truly pathetic and pitiful nonetheless real........the Berlin wall has indeed been pulled down and since then the Nationalist Party has won 5 elections and a referendum and been in govt. for 20 years.......we are well and truly well, alive, kicking and governing Ms. Maria Vella!!!

Patrick Vella

May 10th 2008, 20:37

Mr. Cauchi what about

'HADD MHU GHAR-RIMI'
'FTIT MINN HAFNA'

or you are one of those persons who are doing very well in opposition????

Noel Barry

May 10th 2008, 18:27

Dear Charles Marsh. What's wrong if we choose our leaders the way you said. We chose Eddie and he beat your 3 leaders, Mintoff, Mifsud Bonnici and Sant, besides winning the referendum and bringing peace to this beloved country. Now there is Gonzi and still we are in Goverment. Why dont you copy our winning ways.

Maria Vella

May 10th 2008, 18:18

I really pity the Nationalist party supporters congregating on this post like limp bees to their hive. I do not blame them. A boring NP Government taking them nowhere fast other than to the bottom of most EU tables, a boring leader who makes looking at drying pain an exuberant experience. I can understand their envy and desire to form part of an active dynamic party where things happen. I suppose it is not fair that labourites should have all the fun. Well that is the price you pay for wanting to hold on to power. Now just be good boys and girls and go listen to your kap and applaud at the right moment and read boring newspaper reports on how great was his boring speech. Perhaps one day this century you may realise that the Berlin wall has been demolished and we breathe fresh free air...in the meantime you may stay in your Partit Glorjuz lol daydreaming of lush spaces Maghtab iwarrad. Today Maghtab was fuming like Dante's inferno.

Albert Gauci Cunningham

May 10th 2008, 17:40

PN VS. MLP----What is it in this country that when a Party does something wrong they turn around and say "....heqq mhux anke huma...!" ?? What kind of flawed reasoning is this?? Are these the best aspirations MLP supporters have? ?? Is this the best they can come up with??? The PN; delegates or not ( the leader is chosen by around 800 delegates in the PN) won the majority in 1981, 1992, 1998, 2003 referendum, 2003 with Eddie fenech Adami and 2008 with Gonzi so the choices made by the delegates left the desired results!! after all a Political party's raison d'etre is to win elections not to sustain a particular clique of power hungry officials!!
LOGISTICAL PROBLEMS---This would be funny if it weren't so sad, so a Party which prides itself of representing half Malta does not have the resources to allow 19,000 people to vote for their leader?.....and whats this about PN activists in the MLP?? So you MLP supporters are telling me that a relative minority of the "tesserati" are PN activists?? If thats the case then boy oh boy are you in a crisis!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
TOLERANCE--------so the mask does come down ultimately and as we say in maltese 'iz-zejt jitla f'wicc l-ilma"....these ppl who filled heaps of space telling us how "hamalli" "faxxisti" and intolerant the Uni sts were for booing Dr.Sant during a discussion booed and obstructed a Labour MP and implied that she has an agenda. Well if MARLENE PULLICINO has an agenda why on earth did you let her contest the election on the MLP ticket?? Seems like after the JPO saga for the PN we might have an MPO saga in the MLP........they used her to attract ex-PN votes and now they accuse her of a 'hidden" agenda.........what a bunch of hypocrites...........and one last word to those who feel sooooo hurt when a PN activist criticises Sant and shed litres of crocodile tears telling us ".....tal-PN f'attakki personali vili"...well the only vile attacks here are by MLP supporters calling us "PN Lickers"


............well at least we lick victory not defeat!!.................".....remind me, how much is a lifetime tessera in the MLP?

Wisitin Schembri

May 10th 2008, 17:38

If I were an MLP supporter (or delegate), I wouldn't worry much about this amendment not going through.

To my mind, this is not the issue.

Rather, I would seriously worry that it looks like that the choice of MLP college of electors of the new leader will probably end up not mirroring the views of the people.

Vincent Cauchi

May 10th 2008, 17:03

Reading through the comments posted here I think that the meanings of “democracy” and “statutory practice” still escape the grasp of many commentators
I think that we all agree that a modern democratic body, be it a political party or a local band club, cannot function in ethical and moral correctness without a set of rules and regulations commonly known as a statute or in the case of nations, a constitution.

Yesterday’s extraordinary general conference convened by Labour was a lesson in correctness and democracy. One of the candidates for Labour`s leadership thought that his chances for success would be greater if the electoral base was widened to the 19,000 paid members of the party and not limited to the 900 delegates. A petition was launched, the necessary signatures were collected and the motion to amend the statute was debated and voted upon. The result was loud and clear: 620 delegates did not agree with George Abela’s idea and voted against the motion whereas only 165 voted in favour.

@Martin Portelli
Now against this clear manifestation of correctness and democracy up jumps Martin Portelli and calls the whole thing a farce. If farces are made of this stuff just tell me when to start laughing. Martin Portelli also thought fit to bring in Joseph Muscat in his comment alleging that his stalwarts heaped insults on the speakers for the motion. If certain arguments in favour of the motion were so weak and banal, you cannet blame the delegates present for expressing their disagreement. Did Martin Portelli identify every single delegate who murmured or sighed? Let us try to be more objective and less prejudiced in our comments
@Saviour Cachia

Saviour Cachia had every reason to feel bitter this morning. He was one of the staunchest campaigners in favour of George Abela’s idea to move the goal-posts after the match had started. But he should not have poured all his bitterness over Jason Micallef just because 620 delegates who had the right and obligation to decide upon the motion did not respond to his fanatical crusade. This is democracy Mr Cachia and if you do not accept it it is your problem. Saviour Cachia was wrong to attack Michael Cohen, Paul Farrugia and Aleander Balzan for speaking against the motion. They were exercising a sacrosanct democratic right. Is this the sense of openness and free debate that Mr Cachia believes in? Is this what Mr Cachia wants to see in Labour if the candidate he is so strongly supporting wins the election?

@Patrick Vella

Yes you are right to dispose as you wish with you hard earned cash. Labour will not go bankrupt without your contribution. As they say “With every door that closes another one opens” and I am sure that the new leader, whoever he or she is, will do his or her best to make up for Patrick Vella’s withheld contributions.

What Labour needs after June 5th is solidarity behind its new leader and not whiners who have no grasp of democracy and no sense of the rules of the game. Worse still, in such comments, I note a serious lack of loyalty towards the party they profess they love.

charles marsh

May 10th 2008, 16:28

I can't believe what i'm reading. How can the Nationalists talk this way. You chose Gonzi with just 450 councillors . And you chose saliba with less then 50 executive members. Is that democracy. Mind your own business and leave us alone. We do not need your advise. I am a party member and has been for a very long time, and would have loved to vote for my new leader, but I always believed that's the decision of the delegates and I agreed with this decision .

Bill Millam

May 10th 2008, 16:25

Reading some of the Malta Losers Party (MLP) supporters' comments on here just continues to reinforce my belief of how much IMHAWDIN these poor souls are. Many of them just seem to have resigned themselves to the fact that the opportunity to be in government again just diminishes with each passing day while some others still have the arrogant attitude of that dictator Dom Mintoff instilled in them. 20-odd years in Opposition has apparently thought them nothing, zilch, nada, ZERO. Oh wait, but isn't that what their last miserable PM was known as? ZERO: you remember that KMB guy!

Viva l-Partit Glorjuz Nazzjonalista.

Sean Sciculna

May 10th 2008, 16:14

It's a real shame reading such comments about this article. I find it rather baffling all these bandwagon of PN cheerleaders suddenly showing so much interest in the MLP's strategy. Claiming that they are interested because it is in the country's interest is a proof of their mask! It sad though, to notice all this sarcasm directed at the MLP delegates. PN supporters believe they have a divine right to govern... & they believe MLP are lower class of people. And then tehey speak of morality and values... Give me a break, your arrogance will prove to be your downfall!

Charles Camilleri

May 10th 2008, 16:07

Victor Lavaira, by trying to involve the PN will not solve labour's problem. According to one ex labour Minister the NP has won a great victory. They won the election after twenty years in Govt.It was the only party that won the election after Malta's entry into the European Union and the introduction of the Euro. It won the election despite the onslaught from every quarters even from those who should know better. According to this ex Minister had the thousands of Nationalists voted instead of staying at home the the Nats. would have had a majority of more than10,000. In this context one can imagine the MLP's defeat. The Nats system of Administration resulted only in success, while labour's system has resulted in total failure.

George Cremona

May 10th 2008, 15:55

The biggest problem in the MLP is that the their men at the top or most of them together with the delegates are blind, deaf but have big mouths. They are blind to realities which are changing everyday. They are deaf to the truth of changing realities. But they are not hesitant in hurling insults, threats and anything that hurts at whoever possesses different opinion or view from theirs. They do not want change because in change they see a big threat to their position. Change equals elimination of the old guard to whom they belong. So it is change and not the PN their biggest enemy.

This is the truth, nothing but the sad truth with the MLP which in the not too distant future it would have one and only one change which would be the last from MLP to RIP.

G. Sammut

May 10th 2008, 15:48

Dear Mr. Martin Portelli,

(1) The arrogance of your argument is nothing more than an unfortunate case of sour grapes. I wholeheartedly believed that this was a motion in favour of democracy rather than attempt to claim victory by a particular candidate. However now it is even more evident, by your own words, that there was nothing genuine in the motion.

(2) Stating that this was somehow orchestrated by Joseph Muscat or anyone else is evidence of the poorness of your logic. Truth be told there were no winners yesterday except for two losers. One was George Abela as it was nothing more than an attempt of a show of force by him and the second, and worst of all, was the Labour Party itself which was forced into a lose-lose situation by people who have none other than their own selfish interests at heart.

(3) The easy lash of your accusations and your reactions at yesterday's defeat are the sole reason why Labour has been forced into opposition since 1998. It is people like you who are the greatest bane of this beloved worker's party.

(4) Had you listened to the arguments being put forth by the promoters of yesterday's motion you would have easily understood the hollowness of their intent, not that this change is not good in itself, however, it needs to be done with thought, a thorough discussion (and not a 1 hour debate) and with everyone involved, fully understanding its consequences. Furthermore, this reform alone will make no difference unless it is accompanied with many other urgent reforms which the party needs. However, irrespective of the impact of this motion on the party, of its repercussions and consequences, of its timing and of its mechanisms, (which in my opinion where all wrong) people who had vouched 10 years ago to do all that is within their power to harm the party presented us with this motion with the sole intent of fulfilling their agenda, i.e. de-legitimizing the process of reform that the party needs to go through in order to become an electable and true modern European Social Democratic party.

(5) I agree with one thing with what you said: 'The proof of the pudding is in the eating'. We tasted your pudding one more time and again it was inevitably sour.

On the other hand, Mr. Portelli, in the true spirit of inclusiveness I am sure that a hand will be extended your way to join in our battle to restore a Labour government after the 5th of June. It is now only up to you and others like you to accept.

R Borg

May 10th 2008, 15:02

I wish the PN will have the same guts to do what Labour did and give half a chance to his delegates to choose not the leader but the secretary general. Come on Saliba show us how democratic you are.

Abel Abela

May 10th 2008, 14:41

The plan to get Labour delegates to give in and grant voting rights to card holders was botched from the start. Which assembly has ever been willing to vote itself out of power? From day 1 it was perceived as a plan to get you-know-who into the driving seat. There's no way paid up members by June 2007 could have known that they would be getting more than their money's worth - a LM2 ticket to appoint a new MLP leader . There's no point in criticizing the PN because of Labour's internal woes. Fact is, 620 MLP delegates shot down the proposal to widen the party's decision making base in the most crucial of decisions - that of choosing the party leader. In doing that, they shot themselves in the foot.

I was not at all surprised with the vote. But I was shocked to see the poisoned darts shot ferociously by 'New Labourites' against fellow party members. What future can there be for any organization where healthy debate, restructuring and self-criticism are a badge of treason?
This is hardly the way forward for Labour. Whoever is elected leader on 5 June risks becoming an irrelevant detail if 2013 will have already been lost in the first 90 days.
Forty years ago Labour modernized this country. Now it cannot even modernize itself.
Mene, Mene, Tekel, Upharsin.

Jurgen Cassar

May 10th 2008, 14:35

Those who are saying that PN Leader is chosen by 60 people, they are mistaken. The PN Leader is chosen by party councillors (not local councillors) which amount around 800. The only difference between the MLP and PN Leadership contest is, that the PN elected its leader while in Government few months a historical victory in 2003 . The result of the PN Leadership election , resulted fruitful in the last general election.

On the otherhand , MLP's situation is, that they have to elect a leader, after 3 consecutive defeats. So I think , the MLP is more in need to change the formula. But yesterday the same Party delegates that have to elect their leader , chose to shoulder again this responsability.

Maria Pace

May 10th 2008, 14:27

To Suzanne Buttigieg,

I wonder, how did you come up with the conclusion that Joseph Muscat is not popular among the labourites let alone the Nationalists?In my opinion, it is the Nationalists which are saying this just like they did with Alfred Sant. Pity, there are still people who believe such falsehoods.

I think it is a conclusion which you drew TOO early and without factual corroboration, might I say.

M. Bugeja

May 10th 2008, 14:25

I find it funny how people who only consult with the media of a party can claim to have knowledge about the political process. If they voted against, that's their right to voice their opinion. I don't see why people can suddenly jump on a bandwagon and jump to all sorts of conclusions when they see things in shades of black and white, which is utterly ridiculous in politics.

On the other hand, its true that it would be difficult to pull off a vote with so many members in so little time. And a small number of these members are paid members of both parties.

Personally, if they voted that way, so be it. But I really don't understand why everyone complains about EVERYTHING the other political party does, when it's clear that neither have a halo above their heads (despite what several of the more naive supporters may believe).

I hope the younger Maltese generation is not half as partisan as the last few generations were, for all our sakes.

ivan camilleri

May 10th 2008, 14:16

Mr.Peter Muscat has just showed what kind of followers MLP has.........
Joining a party just because you've just read something against that party is an utter joke with all due respect!! I say it again :
MLP is confined & blocked in the past. The party's practices have merely changed from the time MLP was still @macina. I quote someone well known to them who said that labour should open all doors & windows & let the wind rush throughout & change all air within.......maybe one day we'll be dealing with a true modern opposition!!

Someone mentioned net tv & 101........is this a sick joke? Do you watch one tv's news may i ask??!! Do you stick 30min listening to the utter chaos,tragedies,alarm, failures & all sorts of situations they want to make us believe? Do you listen to super one? Its as if the election is still approaching..........namely one person who everybody knows who he is........

Seems like the time MLP is going to change is as possible as having an alien as my neighbour who talks to me about the champions league.......

Victoria Grech

May 10th 2008, 14:11

Mr Laiviera,

Let us crunch numbers shall we?

You said: The PN Leader - is chosen by about 60 people. The Secretary General is chosen by even less - about 15.

OK, 143468 people voted for the PN to be in government.

Malcolm Attrad

May 10th 2008, 13:49

Well there you have it – the grim truth about the MLP. How foolish were we to think that the problem was just Alfred Sant and the present administration. We have forgotten that they were elected there in 2003 – by these same delegates. So the problem is actually much deeper.

Having read parts of the speeches the anti-member delegates gave, I realise why the MLP has lost 3 successive elections and a referendum.

The problem with the MLP is much deeper. Its voting base – workers- is not the same any more. A lot of he ‘ workers’’ children have climbed up the social ladder to form part of the middle class thanks to the free education system which had been unavailable for their parents. Speaking for myself a worker’s son, I find myself in exactly this situation. If the delegates who spoke yesterday are representative of what the party is today then I am afraid it is not my party anymore. I have only voted PN once (for the EU) and will never vote again for them in my life, but then neither do I feel happy voting MLP any more. I know several other people in my same situation who do not share the same sense of loyalty to the MLP.

The MLP today does not represent the aspirations of the middle class – I hate to say it but that only leaves it with lower class and there simply are’nt enough voters in that class today to get it back in government.

JOHN SCERRI

May 10th 2008, 13:19

Dear Saviour Cachia,
It seems your elaborate good advice like that of many others fell on deaf ears.

This is a quote from one of your own earlier comments of this week - which i agree with.
"...The five contenders main task is to explain the delegates that there is still a lot of work to be done, principally the emendment of the MLP statute, before a new leader is elected.
And certainly the new leader should be elected by all the paid up members eligible after a rigid scrutiny...".

From the way I see it there is but only one contender who is being given a very big push forward to become leader. No need for spoon feeding here. All can do their 1+1.

t borg

May 10th 2008, 13:12

When do we get to know about PN elections? How many people have a say in PN elections? Maybe 60? definetely less than a 100.

The MLP leadership is another way of keeping people alienated from more important issues for the general public such as the suggestion of paying ex-members of parliament, Pullicino Orland, the protests at MCAST, the promises made by PN before the elections, the worst off in EU tables and on and on and on....

Finally, since when do people out of a group feel such an urgent need in intruding in that group's interests? .. thankyou but no thankyou.

David Gatt

May 10th 2008, 12:51

I am a Labour Party member, not a delegate. Still, I am very happy that this motion was defeated. The reasons being these:

1. I don't recall any other organization where the leader or director is not chosen by its board/delegates. Examples: PN, local band clubs, banks and other organizations, etc. These institutions all have their 'delegates' and their 'paid up members'. Still its always the delegates who make the choices, so why should it be only different for MLP?
2. Giving paid up members the right to vote is risky, because we all know that there are PN supporters who are paying Labour's membership. Sorry, but I don't trust PN faithfuls with electing the future Labour leader.
3. The delegates are already themselves being elected by paid up members. So if you're a paying Labourite you have the right to choose the delegates you want. So its not an excuse to say the party's officials make their choices alone, cause you can choose to elect whoever you like.
4. The sense of this motion was not for MLP's good. It was the one and only hope for George Abela to stand a chance in becoming leader. Since he knows that there are PN people paying Labour's membership he thought he might stand a chance by getting their votes. How good is that for Labour? A prospective Labour leader hanging his hopes on PN supporters! Dear George, we aren't that stupid.

Noel Barry

May 10th 2008, 12:48

Just stop mentioning the PN and how it will elect the new General Secretary. We are happy with our system and this gave us a record number of wins. It is you labourites who never agree with each other. So how can you expect to govern democratically if democracy does not reign within your party.

C Calleja

May 10th 2008, 12:46

Lets face it. Was there any choice for delegates in 2003 ?

Montalto or Farrugia ?

This time round it is different. At least there are Abela, Muscat and Bartolo while Falzon and Preca are also important and may be good leaders.

This time roung labour delegates are spoilt for choice and i am convinced that whoever is elected will be a valuable asset for the party.

A. Attard

May 10th 2008, 12:38

I just cannot understand the comments put in by MLP supporters who fear change - extending the hand of democracy to the party members is a positive action - saying that the PN's method is somewhat similar to that of the MLP and trying to pass the message that a PN General Secretary is elected with a mere 50 vote election does not justify the rejection of voting rights to the MLP's party members.

Also it verges on the farcical hearing comments that one cannot organise an election for 19,000 or is it 35000 party members in 27 days!....and pre election statements by the MLP reiterated that the party was ready even if an election is called tomorrow! The fear of change comes natural but the courage to change in the right direction is surely needed for the two big parties - who will therefore be the first to extend voting rights to its members? The MLP has lost its chance to be the first party...will it be another first for the PN? Time will tell.

Patrick Vella

May 10th 2008, 12:36

Thanks to the MLP delegates, with their decision, my savings account at the end of the year will end up with more money. Bye - Bye now the membership and the 'Gbir ta' Fondi".
Mr. Cohen, Mr. Farrugia (mayors) and the rest of the delegates must carry the responsibilities of their decision.
But their is enough time to think again, when they are going to cast their vote for the new leader on the 5th June.

laurence schembri

May 10th 2008, 12:32

Ms. Maria Pace, I do not give a damn how the Nationalist Party run their affairs, it is their own business. But, look at the result, un-democratic, hidden agendas, lies, arrogance, nepotism, etc...etc., the way I look at it is ,we had a good opportunity to open up our party in a very viable democratic way and we did not. , and that is that.

vella james

May 10th 2008, 12:08

to andrew borg cardona - democracy and winning is a different thing... and by the way don't forget that PN "won" by 1500 votes and did not get absolute majority. Something wrong in PN there must be too.

Whilst if I voted I owuld have opened teh gate for all members to vote, I see MLP is maturing in that nowadays things are done in a transparent way and using democratic means - something which the PN cannnot cope with.

Regarding Gorg Abela - if he has the support of 30% already - that is not a bad thing; If he can increase his base to 40% by time of election he is virtually assured a run-off place. (let's not forget that vote willbe divided between 5 contenders !!)

A. Scicluna

May 10th 2008, 11:54

Unbelievable! So do u really think that motion would have favoured only Gorg Abela ? What about JM? He's popular with Labourites. now, to top it all, the delegates will elect either the person who, along with others, was responsible for the electoral defeat..and who is now after a promotion; or the person who was pushed and is being supported by people who had prominent roles in the MLP for the past 16 (disastrous) years. So dear Gorg Abela, Please don't bother. We will never learn .. go on and enjoy your retirement in perfect harmony.

And dear delegates, since you didnt have faith in members, like me, who have elected you, we will return the favour when the time comes .. the Untouchables !!

C. E. Taliana

May 10th 2008, 11:48

I'm very curious at how MLP decided on its past Electoral motto - Pjan ghal Bidu Gdid, because after yesterday it seems to me that not even the delegates are ready for a Bidu Gdid! What a shame.

David Spiteri

May 10th 2008, 11:46

To all "PN Lickers", Ask your masters how your administration is elected. Then, just TRY to offer an amendment and see what will happen to you!! What happened this night in the MLP headquarters is TRUE democracy, but what will happen in the night the new PN's Secretary General be elected is what happens in a Dictatorship.
Although I'm in favour of Gorg Abela as leader of MLP, you are all underestimating Joseph Muscat. He is more younger, energetic and charismatic than Gonzi!
One more thing again to all PN Lickers: It is better to see what is happening in your party this time round because after all, June 5 comes and passes and the MLP will get on stronger day by day any leader is chosen BUT the problems this election caused to your party do not seem have an end. If you don't know what are these problems, do not watch any more NET tv but ask your masters the truth, maybe they will tell you. But I do not think they will ever admit. Yes somethings never changed .......... PN is one of them!!! Why? Because they never admit their problems or even a defeat. You all forgot when labour won the 96 election with a photofinish result? (photofinish = 12,000 so what is 1,500?)

Jennifer Cosaitis

May 10th 2008, 11:38

The only difference there is that the PN managed to be sucessful in their choices, whichever post were to be filled, whereas in the MLP, the party is a living fiasco. It seems impossible that one can shoot himself in the foot even further. Doesn't the part ever learn.

Oh and Randoph, of course party members should not have the same say in choosing a party leader! It isn't their vote thats needed to win their election, ux?

Gerard Mangion

May 10th 2008, 11:36

Dear MLP delegates, you had just confirmed that you don't even trust your own Suldati tal- Azzar !! Where is the Bidu Gdid ? maybe in 2023 ??

Back to sqaure one ! as the 70's & 80's.

m.portelli

May 10th 2008, 11:35

@ G.Sammut

Joseph Muscat is really going to thank you for lumping him together with Saddam Hussein . Excellent fodder well done! He's out for the Mother Theresa of all daydreams yes? ( A Labour Victory just in case you didn't get it!)

S.Casolani

May 10th 2008, 11:34

Actually, I think the decision taken was the result of a democratic move on behalf of the MLP. The motion was discussed and eventually voted against, as expected. To be honest, the vote of the delegates seems to reflect the wishes of MLP in general. Speaking to a number of Labourites over the last few weeks, I was surprised by how many disliked George Abela and would never want him as their leader. Many still consider him a traitor and trouble maker within the party and do not want him to have anything to do with the leadership of MLP. Bottom line is that if there had to be a hypothetical vote amongst all voters who voted labour during the election, then George would still not have a chance. Shame as I believe he would make a competent leader, but useless if most people within your party don't want you! The question now is, "will the delegates follow the script and vote for Muscat, or will we see some surprises?" It could be close.

Sandro Pace

May 10th 2008, 11:29

Only time will tell whether this was or was not a good decision by the MLP, and probably not even then, for whether the MLP wins or not does not entirely depends on the opposition party, but also on government performance (in its widest sense).

As we've seen, voting patterns in Malta take a different trend from other EU countries. In that, people dont vote to change just for change's sake, or to try a fresh face.

In my opinion, whoever they chose by whatever system, the less confrontational one they chose the better for the party itself, in terms of attracting floaters.

Malcolm Buttigieg

May 10th 2008, 11:28

Dear ABC (or Beck, or bocca)

I have been reading your contributions for the past years and honestly, I still have not figured out what you really care about.

Is it fine dining perhaps?

Can you please elaborate on the meaning of the last three words in your comment earlier, that is, "we do care"

Alfred Grima

May 10th 2008, 11:26

Mr M.Bonello, waiting for a great divide, wishful thinking, keep dreaming.

martin portelli

May 10th 2008, 11:11

May I as a true Labourite extend my hearty congratulations to the visionary leaders who with sustainers like Michael Cohen and Paul Farrugia have hijacked the workers movement. “Biex tiskonġra vera trid kun pur!!” Since yesterday's farce evidently wanted to give Joseph Muscat sustainers the sense of security they so evidently lack I have to ask the question to their anointed messiah. How is Joseph Muscat going to rationalise the level of intolerance, the outright insults, booing, the evident cronyism! Did he take a note of the insults heaped on the speakers for the motion by his stalwarts rather than rebut their arguments? (How indeed is the incumbent party administration going to spin this on.) That’s new Labour, il-partit ta kullhadd? Sweetheart your strategist got it wrong . Surely you don’t think that such behaviour is congruent with tolerance and inclusion? Is it a new strategy to further the education of delegates? That is the inclusiveness hype. Is this the way forward? And you might have thought that the students at university were rude! They might have an average age of 21+ but really what was the average age of those 600 + delegates 55? I really want an answer to this. I do not contest the right of people to vote the way they wish to ( or for the matter if they concede to do the bidding of others) but to have the cheek to grin your way through this is an affront even to the monosynaptic. I would also like the take of the Labour’s philosophers on this. What will delegates be requesting next that a big footnote is added to the history of the MLP which reads: ‘we decided today to consign the MLP and the hopes and aspirations of our sustainers to the dustbin. To hell with the wishes of our sustainers let alone of the electorate at large but please make sure you dosh the cash when we ask for it) .’ plus ca change, plus c'est la meme chose?.
I heartily urge the other very valid contestants MLC, GA, EB, MF to make sure that they give it their utmost to ensure that Labour remains true to its principles and that they will not ignore us who dare to think differently. They can rest assured that they will have our support. We will embrace what is creative and truly progressive not what is scripted down to the last pause. To others, Please do not naively expect not to be taken to task by those who have every right as the Cohens and the Farrugias to voice their opinion. I for one, will not be hissed down! I will really be keen to see if those that propose a new way of doing politics in Malta will put their money where their mouth is with regards inclusion. I am sure now that the avoidant silence is going to be deafening. However, I wish the winners well and after the euphoria some time out to meditate on the true meaning of their pyrrhic victory.
Truly a case that the proof of the pudding lies in the eating.

Malcolm Seychell

May 10th 2008, 10:56

@ABC

ABC is right. The PN system works perfectly. To win 3 election in a row is no joke, especially the last one with a new leader and also we had the introduction of the Euro.

Joe Saliba said he has no problem in changing the system how the PN votes for their leader and this is from someone who has a perfect track record so change is not necessary needed.

Yet we have the laburisti who do not want to change after 30 years with practically a minority of votes

Now probably the new leader will be yet another puppet of Sant's people.

This might be good news for the PN and other parties but certainly bad news for Malta

Joe Cardona

May 10th 2008, 10:50

Yesterday. MLP should how democracy works in the party. The MLP didn't do what the PN did in 1970's to choose their leader by meeting in the middle of the night and away from their delegates or how they call them Tesserati besides also behind their leader's back.

Suzanne Buttigieg

May 10th 2008, 10:38

MLP please open your eyes. If Mr. Muscat is not even popular amongst Laborites, how do you expect Nationalists to vote MLP the next time round? Its their vote that counts not the delegates'.

saviour cachia

May 10th 2008, 10:36

I feel bitter this morning, perhaps not to the extent of Jason Micallef, General Secretary of the Malta Labour Party, who assured those in his circle of a 4%win in the March 8 General Elections, was on March 9.
Smile Jason, smile. You won the battle. Perhaps ultimately the delegates will marshal on and elect as leader the person that suits you, after having done so during the last three consecutive defeats in the general elections.
Thanks Honorable and privileged delegates Michael Cohen , Paul Farrugia and former colleague Aleander Balzan, for proving the mess the MLP is in. First and foremost we do not actually known the exact number of paid up members.
First we faced the spin of 35,000, then was finally reduced to 19.000.
From an accountable and transparent party, the MLP boasts to be, I expect the publishing of the full list of the paid up members. I do not give a damn what the Nationalist Party do. Like it or not, they have been successful for three consecutive general elections.
And the honorable and privileged delegates argues: the former leader was not to blame, the administration was not to blame, the delegates were not to blame, the members were not to blame. Perhaps our dear departed who voted or abstained in the European Union referendum are to blame. At. least on March 8, they, God grant them eternal rest , unfortunately missed their appointment and disappointed Jason, who it seemed might have added them in his surveys which to his records showed we were 10,000 votes ahead of the Nationalist Party. A figure, which Gonzipn did not shudder to erase with the great faculty of incumbency!!!!
Do not worry, be happy. The Malta delegates Party has won. They will be electing the new leader, most probably to the fancy of Jason Micallef and Co, and the future Prime Minister. The survey amongst the 670 delegates who had dismissed a motion for the party to open up to paid up membrs, says the 2013 General Elections will surely see a Labour victory.
Dear comrade delegates, bask in your glory. Be happy taking full responsabilty of a party who cannot as yet decide which is the correct number of paid up members: 35,000 or 19.000??!! Certainly this will be the new leader first challenge to clarify matters and give us tangible and accountable proof, of who form part of this damn membership list and its actual number. Hope that in an open party as ours, we paid up members deserve such account.
How can we convince that we are the right party to put Malta and Gozo matters in order, when we are all but shambles in the red glass palace. 27 days not enough to organize a way how 19,000 will have a say in the election of the new leader. What a pity. What a cheek. Whose face should be red, mine or those who voted against the motion, last Friday?

effie carbonaro

May 10th 2008, 10:32

i am a member not a delegate and i am happy the way things went.would this motion have passed if it was presented by any other canditate?it didnt pass because it was presented by gorg abela.a man that most delegates and members dont have faith in.a man that is at war with the gwu.a man who ran away when most needed.a man who promised to reshuffle the mlp thus causing more harm then good because it seems he wants to destroy certain mlp commitee members he dosnt see eye to eye with them.and the last but not least his age.i cant imagine someone giving a new image to a party at the age of 60.

Michael Catania

May 10th 2008, 10:29

To all those conservatives who think they know how democracy within the MLP should work , need only to look no further then their convictions. To those who think the MLP can't win the next election only time will tell. The consevatives are excellent at deceiving the electorate, after all the MLP don't have within its confines a JPO or others of the same like. Finally I suggest that all these knowalls should make there opinions known to their masters, but on the other hand I know what sort of reaction from those masters will be , just ask John Dalli. Some time I feel that these people are remotelly controlled by radio 101 or net TV because they certainly are not intellegent enough to see wht the NP is all about.

G.Sammut

May 10th 2008, 10:26

Dear all,

What these die-hard PN apologists are saying is absolutely true. Some things never change. The PN will always belittle the MLP when it asks to be considered equal. The PN will always belittle the MLP when it does its duty to scrutinize the government when the latter is not delivering. In fact, we all know that anything the MLP does is an act of terrible despotism reminiscent of Cambodia right? Shame on representative democracy and its wicked, malignant ways!

Let me give it to you straight. The PN are angry for one simple reason. They don't give two hoots about the right of members to vote or democracy. They only see this as a vote of no confidence in George Abela; their Saviour; their Prophet; their Dalai Lama. They tremble, now, at the thought of Joseph Muscat winning the Leadership; the great diabolical nemesis who makes Saddam Hussein look like Mother Theresa. Little do they know that there are several delegates who are against the motion and still in favor of George Abela as leader. Perhaps they should consider why? Perhaps they should consider the possibility that at least Labour discussed this motion and that it may still be on the books. But they want it NOW, not in the interest of democracy, but in the interest of one candidate and thats is. Punto e basta.

Ironically, they care!

Peter Muscat

May 10th 2008, 10:24

Some comments by certain contributors are full of spite and as always deceit. Of course, spite and deceit are the trade marks of most of the "PN lickers".

Yesterday was another demonstration of Democracy in practice. I wonder of any PN paying member or PN MP has the courage to forward a similar motion to Party General Conference and how it would be dealt with.I bet hell would break lose.

A. Dalli's comment is ample proof of the above. I am not an MLP paying member. But I will certainly be one as soon as possible. Above that I will surely convince my friends to join the party. Just came to that decision on reading A. Dalli's spiteful comment.

Finally it is much more appropriate if the most of the 'vile comments' on the MLP were reversed on the NP, the party that condones political hatred throughout its existence.Not just towards the MLP but all its political opponents. EG Strickland's Party.Lies and deceit were always the PN's trademark. EG .." TERRINU".

The PN or its clones can never preach others anything different then it practices. It can teach spite, hate, discriminations, injustices, abuses, corruption, manipulations of events, lies and political deciet.

John Grima

May 10th 2008, 10:21

It seems to me that to ask the delegates to extend the vote to the whole membership is like asking Turkeys to vote for Christmas.

J Caruana

May 10th 2008, 10:20

I´m not surprised that the PN spin has worked. PN supporters and floaters who believed they were being fed some sort of showcase of extended democracy (by having the MLP elect its leader through a wider electoral base), want to blame the MLP now for having done just that: taken a democratic decision!
Nobody asks why the PN leader should not be elected from its membership, rather than its party councillors; nobody questions the democratic credentials of the PN choosing its secretary-general and party officials by secret vote in the administrative council.
Whether or not Labour chooses its leaders from 900 or 19,000 leaders is not the issue, but which leader will take this party to a European socialist dimension that champions civil rights, the environment, and a radical redistribution of wealth that does not stifle free enterprise.

Victor Laiviera

May 10th 2008, 10:15

The PN Leader - is chosen by about 60 people. The Secretary General is chosen by even less - about 15.

So let's cut all the hypocritical heat-burning about democracy please, and stop pointing at the straw in our neighbour's eye and ignore the beam in our own.

Louis Grech

May 10th 2008, 10:11

After all I think it was a wise decision I just hope that it wasn't intended to play in favour of a candidate. I do not think that the majority of the delegates are undemocratic or stupid people. Almost all organisations anywhere in the world including political parties are oligarchic in nature and thus democracy is always an illusion no matter what.

Francis Abela

May 10th 2008, 10:08

well done! this was just intended to accomodate one single candidate in the race (george abela) but the delegates were not taken for a ride! so I just hope that he doesn`t continue to play any more dirty tricks. this is a clear indication that delegates does not want george abela. and no wonder why!!!!

Anthony Cassar

May 10th 2008, 10:05

This is what democracy is all about.I am still waiting to see something like this motion being put forward to the PN delegates,then and only then they will have the right to advise and express thier minds,or is it like always,two ways two measures?

ivan camilleri

May 10th 2008, 10:03

Well said ABC.....just took my words from my mouth in the nick of time. When i hear labourites mentioning the PN way i smile at heart.......how dare they? Its the MLP which is a shame to our country, with its 70/80's style of politics & agendas.

Joe saliba? Once the time comes for him to leave it will happen & no problems should arise....unlike to mr.Jason Micallef who has been humiliated by another loss & still wants to cling to power.......(power in the glasshouse means nothin at all). At least Joe saliba will step down as a winner......on the other hand jason still thinks he has plenty to give to his "united" party......

i wonder what.......

O. Grech

May 10th 2008, 09:59

The delegates just had the opportunity once again, to learn from their past mistakes and ensure that the party goes through a reform, which indeed is required if mlp wants to be a good alternative for the pn government... but as a famous advert says: some things never change....mlp is one of them.

Randolph De Battista

May 10th 2008, 09:58

@ Borg Cardona - There you go! MLP is undemocratic because only delegates vote for the leader, but PN is a virgin democracy Guru, despite having less "delegates" or councilors voting for their leader.

The big issue behind the "overwhelming" le was the timing of such motion, and the manner in which it was proposed. I personally agree in principle, but I voted against since I don't agree party members should have an equal say in choosing a leader. However I want discussions to continue, especially after there is a new leader.

A Dalli

May 10th 2008, 09:57

Andrew, well said.

Reg Pisani

May 10th 2008, 09:55

To ABC

TELL IT TO THE MARINES!!!!!!!!

Martin Camilleri

May 10th 2008, 09:47

Why all this fuss. PN has the same process for the leader and even worse for the party secretary because it is elected from the party executive only (50 or 60 persons, if I am not mistaken).

These people always two weights and two measures for them.

Andrew Borg-Cardona

May 10th 2008, 09:42

Just a small comment to the people who want the PN to open up its own electoral process: the function of a political party is to win elections. The PN system works for them, because they keep winning. The MLP system, on the other hand, throws up leaders who keep losing. Do the math. It's not a question of the rest of us wanting to impose democracy on anyone, it's a question of the MLP being able to become a viable opposition - believe it or not, we do care.

a.dalli

May 10th 2008, 09:36

Now that the delegates have decided - it is up to the Party members to do their bit.
I mean that members start sending in one's membership card.
Or even stop paying membership fee. Somehow we have to find an antidote to unplug THEM from their seats.

Paul Micallef

May 10th 2008, 09:31

So that's the 2013 election wrapped up for the nationalists. And jason and his super one gang get to keep their jobs. Plus c'a change, plus c'est meme - not that the delegates will understand

C.R. Taliana

May 10th 2008, 09:27

I think this decision will affect badly the renewal of membership. And if this should happen then it is a clear sign that the delegates no longer represent the paid members but just themselves.

Anthony Mizzi

May 10th 2008, 09:26

A shrewd and as democratic choice a truly democratic political party gives to its members and there chosen delegates.


It was a free vote from where 785 delegates expressed through a secret vote the way for the Malta Labour Party, a glorious party , the way to go forward.

That is what true democracy and free choice is all about.

It must surely be the right choice with hereunder comments from Nationalist Party sustainers condemning such a choice. What did R. Galea, Edgar Gatt, Bill Millam expect, we let them, or seek council from the party they support to choose the way the Malta Labour Party be an opposition to the Party they support?

Mark Bonello

May 10th 2008, 09:25

It seems like ................here it comes, the big bang........or the great divide?

Jurgen Cassar

May 10th 2008, 09:19

Now it's in the reponsability of the delegates to choose their leader . The same delegates, with the same system that chose Alfred Sant instead of Lino Spiteri in 1992 .

Delegates , which were chosen under the 16 yrs of Sant's Leadership. I hope that this time round, they will do the right choices. Looking back, I doubt it !

Maria Pace

May 10th 2008, 09:16

I don't know why some nationalists like Bill Millam below and others of the same opinion are always first to criticize every single thing the Labour party does without at least looking at the way their own party does things....correct me if I'm mistaken but the PN doesn't even let its delegates vote to elect a secretery general,for instance, let alone the party members or 'tesserati'! The people who vote are about a mere 50 in number which only goes to show that things are planned to the finest detail beforehand including who will fill a post in the party.
It is really not my preoccupation to see which method the PN uses to elect a person for a post but at least all you below who are commenting and throwing stones, do have the decency to look at the way your party is doing things before attacking.
Having 50 handpicked people to vote is much LESS DEMOCRATIC than having 900, period!

laurence schembri

May 10th 2008, 09:12

Once again the miss-administration of the Labour Party shot itself in the foot. What if the disgruntled members decided on an exodus and withdrew their membership? It is a possibility, where do we go from there? Here we are talking of just over 21% of party membership, maybe this thought never entered the minds of the delegates. In a general election it is not the Delegates that have the power of the vote, but one and all, it is always the party members that do all the donkey work and not the Delegates. If the party need to go forward the administration need to change its mentality and if needed the whole of the administration, we cannot go on behaving like an Ostrich, burying our head in the sand and thinking with our exposed parts. Party Members knew exactly what was going to happen at this conference, this extraordinary conference was a smoke-screen to kill a democratic vote. The problem with the Delegates is; that they are simply the mockingbirds of the administration. You only have to listen to their childish arguments and say to yourself; What am I doing here? We lost a chance to have an open Party and we blew it. Come the next general election, I don't want to be a part of this. One learn from his mistakes...but not this present administration, an overhaul is due in the very immediate future. To Bill Millam I say this; There is nothing `glorious` about the arrogance of his party, it is this present administration that helped his party to carry on mismanaging this country for the next five years...hopefully it will be cut short.

Paul Vella

May 10th 2008, 09:07

Wy don't all these people crying foul leave the MLP doing its work properly as it has been doing during this truely democratic and open process of selecting its leader. Everything is being done above board and every opinion being aired without any hindrance whatsoever. Why should have the delegates decided hastily to change such a delicate process of choosing their leader in the midst of a leadership contest?

Why didn't the PN go for a widescale confirmation of its leadership through a membership vote? Why didn't the PN opt to have at least its top administration officials elected by its Councillors instead of 50 members of the Executive Committee?

What the MLP needs is a swift and sensible decision on its leadership and this is what the delegates will deliver come 5th June. The earlier this is done the better for the Labour Party to come to terms with the fact that it is the party enjoying the support of nearly 49% of the Maltese electorate, just 1500 votes less than the ruling party. The party needs a new leader quickly and after June 5th every Labourite should unite behind anyone who is elected and start building for the future by implementing the necessary reforms and solidly preparing for the electoral challenges in the coming years.

Charles.j.Schembri

May 10th 2008, 09:04

well it seems as if we never learn...back to the old days...good luck to all of you, as i am one who will not vote come next election..................

Victor Laiviera

May 10th 2008, 09:03

Could the posters who have commented here kindly inform us who is to elect the new PN General Secretary?

Please?

M. Cutajar

May 10th 2008, 09:03

Dear Dr. George Abela if I were you I would not even dare contest. It is amply clear that the maximum votes that you could possibly achieve is a mere a 27-30%. Yesterday's vote of non confidence in the much awaited motion has proved that the Malta labour party values dictatorship. The mlp dictatorship is ruled by a group of people under the principle of authoritarianism. The delegates surely know what distribution of power means. What they cannot understand is how stop acting purely selfish.

ivan camilleri

May 10th 2008, 09:01

Well there's nothing more to add apart from what has been said down below. Unfortunately the MLP never changes, learns & respects his true principles.... if there are any!!! Mr.Jason Micallef will be feeling a bit better this morning but his days should be numbered now.......at least that's the word going round the glass-house. I won't be surprised if he still manages to stay on & cling to his pretty office.......not at all!!

Anyway its their affair so they have a right to mix & stuff & mingle their already turmoiled situation.......at least i feel confident & look forward that PN never acts in this same sort, & that after these 5 years most probably will still win another election. MLP will never have my trust, they never learn........so we just leave them there, discussing & digging their own grave.......(Ivan Camilleri, Sliema)

Anthony Busuttil

May 10th 2008, 08:56

Thanks for all the concern shown by those commenting till now. Now how about proposing the same thing for PN, eh? Or does democracy have a different meaning there?

Franco Farrugia

May 10th 2008, 08:53

A surprising result?
Not at all.
And the end result will be as unsurprising!!!
Live on PN, unabated!

Malcolm Buttigieg

May 10th 2008, 08:53

So the MLP has chosen to maintain its present system to elect a new leader. So what?

It was a bold move to put the proposed amendment to the statute to the vote test of the delegates. Although, it must be state that the executive had no other choice.

I suspect that the MLP will be widely criticised for the result of this vote and for the overall decision taken by the delegates.

In this democratic country, it sounds very strange that this rarly happens with respect to the party in government.

Andrew McPherson

May 10th 2008, 08:51

It seems obvious to me that the vote was taken after delegates consulted with each other. The result would be much more fair and even if all party members were allowed to vote. Every party member has a right to say who should lead the party, not just the 800 or so delegates. As said in the article there are about 19,000 members, who are not going to have the choice of the leader they want.

Andrew Borg-Cardona

May 10th 2008, 08:46

When you think about it, asking the delegates to vote for this motion was a bit like asking turkeys to vote for Xmas.

Flippant comments aside, where does this leave people like Marlene Pullicino Orlando? I've nothing against her - on the contrary, she has shown herself to be a person of integrity. Will her integrity allow her to continue to militate within Labour's ranks now that her proposal has been soundly defeated, with booing thrown in for good measure?

Kevin Zammit

May 10th 2008, 08:41

I come from a long line of MLP supporters and was personnally vilified bcause I predicted Labours loss in this last election.

Well here it is again if anybody cares to hear it and I don't care if this gets posted or not. I'm quite tired of this little country with little people thinking they're doing big things. Not even the economist has any restrictions on its comments corner.

We are a generation that do not have to work, pay taxes in Malta AND still live here only if we choose to! Our children will be even more free and the numerous and over-burdened government we have will become ever more insignificant. If I'm reading Austin right this economy, so tiny anyway, will be easily satisfied with just 2 major service providers.

If the PN manages to do that (which should be very easy albeit I have my doubts SGS will remain) all PN government has to do is fix the roads and clean up the environment and they can be assured of staying there for ever.

I really don't think MLP delegates can get more stupid than this.

A.Psaila

May 10th 2008, 08:40

I was in favour of this motion, but it is really funny seeing all you PN supporters saying MLP is anti democratic, when the PN have had the same process. At least the MLP considered it unlike the "most democratic party in the world" but who did not let a simple local election in Zejtun and Marsa go ahead. After all these delegates are elected by the party members. So stop being that kettle which calls the pot black.

Nikita Zammit Alamango

May 10th 2008, 08:39

Dont count your chickens before they hatch and i advice you not to underestimate Dr. Joseph Muscat cause you will be surprised at his capabilities.

M. Micallef

May 10th 2008, 08:29

After 3 consecutive defeats, I expected that things would change. But it seems that nothing is going to change in the Labour Party. I'm a member of this party, let's see now if any of the delegates that represent me would ask my opinion at least!In my opinion, This is lack of democracy!

J BORG

May 10th 2008, 08:23

Yet another "LE" from the "Malta Le Party"..... more pleasures yet to come !!!!!

edgar gatt

May 10th 2008, 08:09

It was very obvious from the start. The lions of 2 months ago shall become the poodles of the future. They might as well not vote now as Joseph Muscat is their anointed leader. It was easy for the PN with Alfred Sant. It shall be much easier with Joseph Muscat

Silvio Caruana

May 10th 2008, 07:32

Who said spring hunting is closed! Jason has called the shots and bagged Dr. Abela! There go Labour's chance to have its best Leader!
Let's see who the delegates will choose! After all, the delegates are 'the chosen ones' from the members as the article stated.

J.Azzopardi

May 10th 2008, 06:32

As i predicted, the delegates have kept to themselves the right to decide on matters whic h concern the future for the Party. If need be change the delegated persons and not the principle.

martin saliba

May 10th 2008, 06:28

I'm not sure if registered members should choose the party leader. What is sure is that time is pressing and there really has not been enough time for disscusion. What is also sure is that the delegates didn't make a very good decision in 2003. In fact they made a very bad one. I am also sure that if Dr. Sant were to offer his services again he would be re-elected as leader. Why the standing ovation? If Mr. Farrugia wanted to thank DR. Sant for anything it should have been for stepping aside and giving Labour the chance to revitalise itself after being given the death sentence when the very wise and knowlegable delagates insisted that he should stay in 2003. It seems that only a very small number of delagates realise or want to admit that we lost the elections because of Dr. Sant. I for one am still peeking through the key hole. Will i come back in or shall i stay out. Just keep in mind that there are probably a few thousand like myself ( Who didn't vote because of Dr. Sant ) and without us labour will be destine to be an oppostion party.

CJohn Zammit

May 10th 2008, 04:34

Those who voted against the motion must have a death-wish for the MLP. A decade in the Opposition hasn't taught them anything. The Sant legacy lives on ... Forward to another ten years in the political wilderness!

When will they ever learn?

Bill Millam

May 10th 2008, 02:29

Some things just do not change! Likewise for the Malta Losers Party. The MLP still has the same mentality like when it was ruled by the dictator Dom Mintoff.
With today's vote, what they have done is once again doomed themselves into more decades sitting in the Opposition chairs.

Viva l-Partit Glorjuz Nazzjonalista.

R Galea

May 10th 2008, 01:57

And the Labour autocracy lives on! Apparently it wasn't just Fredu holding them back, but 620 delegates! Pretty low for a party that hails itself 'Democratic'. Talk about 'paraventus'...